I was in Yokohama yesterday and there was this super loud cosplay girl band on a stage in a public square. I filmed it from a distance for a few seconds for the novelty factor as did another gaijin but the “security” staff (aka 20 something year olds with a T-shirt saying as such) quickly ran over telling us to stop filming.
Seeing as I was on the public sidewalk, the performance – albeit barriered off for ticket holders – was held in an outdoor public area, and they chose not to cover off the event so anyone could see and hear it for hundreds of yards around, I told him there was no law against filming in public and if they didn’t like it they should have not held an event for all to see. He replied that it was copyright, but to me all that means is if I put it up online then they can sue me for copyright violation, it doesn’t mean they can tell me what I can and can’t do with my own phone in public.
Anyway some recent annoyances with arbitrary Japanese rules got the better of me and I ended up in an argument with him. And then to my amusement when I looked back at my video I saw that HE was filming ME with his iphone as he ran towards me.
So this got me curious, assuming I don’t intend to publish online, which I don’t, was I within my rights to film?
17 comments
If a band says no filming, just respect it. You aren’t even a paying customer.
While I don’t see any problem with what you did, I don’t see how that guy acted unreasonably either.
Similar thing happened to me. There was a shoot for a commercial in a VERY public place. To be exact it was right outside Futako Tamagawa’s station surrounded by restaurants and shops and many people, it wasn’t hidden at all. I tried to take a picture just for fun or whatever because it was cool but suddenly every security guard was yelling at me lol. I got the picture and they didn’t actually make me delete it or anything but it kinda shook me up, apparently it’s some unwritten rule Japanese people know but there were no “no photograph” signs that I could see anywhere.
I didn’t argue it or anything though.
Edit: the funny thing was though when the commercial released I watched it and there were a ton of random people in the background of the commercial, I might even be in there somewhere. Seems kinda weird they can film people without their consent and post it publicly but we can’t. There was no way to be in the vicinity without getting in their way because it was like a 360 degree set with the cinema and shops and restaurants all around them. You could have went to a movie and walked out and suddenly there’s a shoot going on and you end up in the background. Or you could have just been trying to walk home from the station or something
Filming in public is completely legal, if somewhat frowned upon. I would’ve told him to pound sand.
As long as you don’t share the video publicly online it’s perfectly legal to film. However, this raises the question of why you would be filming it in the first place unless you were intending to share it online. It’s like recording a video of fireworks: are you *really* going to watch it later? Of course you’re not.
And this leads into two more points:
1) The staff has no way of knowing that you would not share the video online. In this sense, you could consider that he was doing you a favor from a legal perspective.
2) Even if it’s not illegal, it is still incredibly rude to the performers, the staff, and the people who were in attendance.
So now I have to ask: Why are you so upset about it? If they don’t want you to film it then don’t film it. Enjoy things, don’t spend your life staring through the screen of your phone. You weren’t going to watch it later and sharing it online would have been illegal. You’re upset over nothing.
From a legal standpoint, you have every right to film it so long as you’re not breaking other laws while doing it. If you were not allowed to film them legally, then the same would apply to CCTV cameras and those would be illegal.
The rule is: if you’re in public, there should be no expectation of physical privacy, thus, being filmed outside is out of one’s control. What they CAN do is prevent you from posting it anywhere as copyright would take effect, but until that moment, there’s nothing they can do.
You can film it and you can post it, there’s no law against it.
The reason why they can get away with this is because 99% of people just comply like sheep and don’t question if it’s within their rights to film in public areas. If there were 20 people making a fuss over it, things would be different.
If you are not being a nuisance, you can film in public places. The way I see it, the “security staff” were being a nuisance to you.
You argued with him and pushed your opinions instead of apologizing and walking away. This is why Japanese people can’t stand foreigners.
It doesn’t matter if you are filming from a public space or not because it’s an intellectual property issue. Japan has some of the strictest copyright laws in the world. You can’t record a public performance without permission and you especially can’t distribute it, like posting it on YouTube, without permission. You’re lucky the security guard didn’t call the police on you or you could have gotten into some serious trouble. The police take a dim view of confrontations like that with security guards and other people in authority positions, especially when it’s a foreigner.
Self-important 20-somethings. Nobody gives a crap except them.
ITT a bunch of people talking about rights and not bringing up the etiquette of idol culture.
But honestly, aside from it being within your rights or not, if someone asked you to stop filming them or asked someone to ask you to stop filming them like the case is here in a way, why are you still filming them?
Checked the thread and nobody else raised this issue:
It’s an idol group.
They have to be strict about filming & photos because if they aren’t the crowd will be full of dudes trying to take creep shots for fun and/or profit, because the kind of men that like those groups will pay money for a shitty photo/video clip where you can see a little bit more than you were supposed to…
Tokyo Idols (2017) documentary gives a fairly balanced account of the reality of that entire scene.
I accidentally filmed an outdoor shoot of a drama scene and some TV people came up to me immediately and told me no and to delete it.
I was like 5 days into Japan and didn’t know anything so I just complied but looking back it’s quite hilarious. It was literally on a main path to a station on the Yamanote at 9pm.
I once got yelled at by security for taking photos of Tokyo station. On the Marunouchi side in the center plaza.
Did they yell at the dozens of other Japanese people taking photos in front of Tokyo station?
No. No they didn’t.
Only me.
They told me to move along.
As someone who did security multiple times in japan, yes. If it’s out in public, you are free to record. That does not stop them from turning a flashlight on to mess up your shot, but they can’t stop you either. In a private venue, that’s different.
Japanese artists and venues have a long history of ‘no filming’ rules, mainly because of the management’s desire to have an iron-grip control over their artists’ images. Rules have become looser in recent years, but acts with old fuddy-duddy management, especially idols, will still insist on no cameras.
What you did wasn’t illegal, but there was probably a ‘no filming’ sign somewhere and the idols’ bored staff/simp fans used it as a reason to tell you to stop.