I’m a 27M software engineer with 6 year of experience working in the UK earning about £185k/year (¥36M equivalent). I have an offer at hand for about ¥15M/year in Tokyo, am I out of my mind for considering accepting it?
I wouldn’t expect my quality of life to change, but my savings/investments would drop considerably. It’s important to mention that I don’t want to build a family, so I don’t really care about building wealth or retiring early, but it’s still a lot of money.
Would you have taken or would you take this offer if you were in a similar situation?
by Wonderful_Ratio3245
35 comments
This is a copy of your post for archive/search purposes.
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**Taking a 55-60% paycut by relocating to Japan**
I’m a 27M software engineer with 6 year of experience working in the UK earning about £185k/year (¥36M equivalent). I have an offer at hand for about ¥15M/year in Tokyo, am I out of my mind for considering accepting it?
I wouldn’t expect my quality of life to change, but my savings/investments would drop considerably. It’s important to mention that I don’t want to build a family, so I don’t really care about building wealth or retiring early.
Would you have taken or would you take this offer if you were in a similar situation?
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Only you can answer this mate. 15/M a year in Tokyo is a lot of money, don’t forget cost of living is lower in Japan as well so look at ratios instead of totals.
In the end, it comes down to if you wanna move to Japan or not.
> Would you have taken or would you take this offer if you were in a similar situation?
Nobody can answer this except you. We don’t know why you’re considering Japan or how much money means to you
1. If you ever want to move back to the UK, your savings will be almost certainly a fraction of what they would have been if you stayed.
2. If you stay in Japan, you will have more income than 98% of people, and a commensurate amount of purchasing power.
Do you like your life in the UK? Have you been to Japan before for extended amounts of time? What level would your consider your Japanese to be at? Lots of factors to consider
I don’t have a good answer for you. but consider career growth as well. I don’t know the UK tech market but I make 200k in a hcol in US. I could get a comparable salary in Japan (lower but also much lower expenses) but my career growth would instantly shrivel up and die.
At 27 yrs old, I’ll look at the opportunity as “international experience” and use it to grow in the future, stay for a few years, then move on or stay.
If money is very important to you, then moving for much less money is not a smart decision.
For people I know who have made the decision to leave “wherever” and move to Japan, their lives always change:
1. Their cost of living changes, generally it goes down, but there are people I know from places like Texas and Florida who were spending more in Japan.
2. Their happiness changes, those who stay usually find their general happiness increases. There are also people who find they hate it.
3. Their social life changes, again some people have wonderful new improved social lives and some hate every moment of how people interact here.
4. Their expenditures change, some people find they have way less to spend money on as they don’t have cars, houses with lots of garden expenses/yard stuff/etc.
5. Their stress changes, this one is kind of interesting, for some people it’s clearly less stressful (NYC/London people especially) and for some it’s just different.
All these types of things change for people, sometimes they end up being worth it, even if they have less take home income. Nobody can know these things for you, nobody can tell you “how it will be” at the level of specifics. IF someone tells you that something will be exactly a certain way, they are deceiving you with their experiences which might not be like yours.
Hopefully this wall of text helps you out in some way.
I am facing similar problem with my relocation. From around 110k£ to 13mln yen and I feel like it’s not great given current value of yen.
185k pays 70k income tax right?
So what does a 15M salary pay in tax?
I’m a business owner who recently made the move (1.5 years in). If you’re a) senior in career and don’t need the money or rat race promotion progression, b) introverted, and c) want an uptick in life and lifestyle, I’d recommend you move here in a heartbeat.
Japan is a healthy place to live and provides peak quality of living in the world. Coming from the US, the convenience and creature comforts and day-to-day life efficiency is spectacular. The interactions with people are lovely and it’s impeccably tidy and comfortable. You have 35 million neighbors in Tokyo and you can choose to be gregarious or be a hermit and nobody will mind. It’s a place you don’t have to worry about getting mugged or shot in the street. The only things that are maybe a bit of a downside that I could leave behind are the brutal summer and some of the weird bureaucracy tied to social harmony.
If you’re thinking of spending your remaining work years and then taking twilight years here, the 15M/year is ample. Software engineers are very needed here (I should know – I employ them). Downshift, and live a life with multiples greater quality than you have now. Bring money and brains and an attitude of improving those around you, and you’ll be welcomed with open arms.
How TF are you earning that in the UK?
do you have a lot of savings built up? Will the new company help with housing? If yes to both…go for it, especially if it’s something you’ve always wanted to do.
I would think of what your long term life and financial goals are and plan from there. I faced the same situation and decided that since I wasn’t sure that I wouldn’t want to retire in the US in the long run, moving there (again, after a shorter run previously) didn’t make financial sense. It is a tough call and there are no right answers.
Sounds like a really terrible idea, both short-term and long. Just visit on holiday. If you are able to do it without messing up your career and can jump straight back into a job on the same pay scale, take the job in Japan for a year and see it as a sabbatical. But even that sounds like poor advice. 15m is not at all a lot of money in Japan either, unless you compare it to some of the awful jobs people are doing on this sub. For a high quality apartment in Tokyo like many expats here are living in, more than 50% of your budget will be housing. Don’t take advice from people in this sub for whom even 15m is out of reach.
>… am I out of my mind for considering accepting it?
Yes.
Unless it is a dream of yours to live in Japan, are suicidally/homicidally unhappy with your current job, are on the run from MI6, or owe the mob money, I cannot recommend moving to Japan for half of your current salary. Instead, I recommend you visit it on holiday for a couple weeks instead.
I wouldn’t do it, at least not right away. Better to save as much as you can for 3-5 years and then make the move.
15M is a good income but taxes will be high and you’re most likely going to see a drop in your quality of life.
Sure Japan is more affordable but it’s not 50% less, and a lot of things/items you may be accustomed to having in your life are likely even more expensive here.
Even if we account for taxes, I’d say you’d make a good enough living over there and still have enough money to put aside for the future or for leisure.
That being said, it is still way less than what you are currently making and prospective savings will take a hit as a result. Like a few others have already mentioned, I’d say take it only if moving to Japan for the long-term is your dream. Otherwise, you’re probably better off staying where you are and travelling there on vacation.
Take a three month sabbatical on a tourist visa to Japan and just have fun instead?
Can’t work remote? Is asking a death sentence?
>Would you have taken or would you take this offer if you were in a similar situation?
Yes; 100%. I would take a job for even half of what you’re being offered; [¥7.5M/year](https://soranews24.com/2020/08/17/whats-the-minimum-amount-of-money-japanese-women-want-their-husbands-to-earn-survey-investigates/).
I don’t think you’re out of your mind at all. Yes, your ability to save and invest will drop; but, 1) you know that, and 2) you’re young and trying it on won’t cost you what it will cost someone who isn’t.
A lot of Big Tech people, myself included, have come here and left money on the table to do so, and are generally much happier for it. YMMV of course.
As others said, personal decision.
You may or may not like Japan; as is continuously repeated in this subreddit to like 90% of the posts: living there is different from visiting. I mention this because you said in another comment that you visited for 6 weeks in total and don’t know the language at all. Learning the language will unlock a large portion of the country to you, so I would recommend you make it a goal to learn it.
Anyways, the salary that you are getting in Japan should be more than comfortable (in Japan), and you can always move back, so I assume this is a reversible decision. From that perspective, why not?
Also, you say you don’t care about building wealth, yet you are asking whether its out of your mind to consider a large paycut. That seems a bit contradictory. But its natural though; its called loss aversion. Go read about it. If you understand that, I think you already know what you really want to do.
If you want an anecdote, I’m Japanese working in tech in the US, bit older than you. I refrained from moving back home for a while because of the stuff that you mentioned that you say do not matter to you (they mattered to me a lot…at least in my twenties). Financially, undoubtedly my stint in the US has went as I had expected, as I have made several multiples more, compared to what I would have made in Japan. Plus I’ve had a small windfall due to luck (company going public); these circumstances would be pretty rare in Japan, but quite prevalent in my industry and location. Now I can go back home to Japan if I feel like it and just coast.
So maybe another option for you is to save up a bit, research Japan a bit more, then move. But if you truly don’t care about finances, then forget it all and just ask yourself whether you want to move to Japan or not, period.
People from Western countries don’t move to Japan for money or career advancement, they move for the lifestyle benefits and/or the life experience of living in such a different cultural and social environment..
Only you can decide what the priority is for you.
I am much older than you and recently took the salary hit to move over here. I’m still in the early honeymoon period, but I have no regrets so far.
Like most foreigners from developing countries, moving to Japan would be a bad financial decision but we move due to family and lifestyle reasons. I would encourage you to get a mostly remote or digital nomad position in UK, fly to Japan few times a year and work remotely. Once u find your partner here, u can consider moving to Japan. Don’t worry, there are always SWE jobs in Japan
So you’re lucky in that time zones are more on your side to keep getting paid from the UK and just working and living in japan. They have the new digital nomad visa. I’d apply for that. I’m in the U.S. and time zones work out horribly here. You could manage if you really wanted to with the time zones. And basically you’d be in the top 1% of japan. You could literally do whatever you wanted to with the current exchange rate. If Living there is the ultimate end goal tho, why not take the pay cut?
I’m in an almost identical situation right now, age, pay and everything. My current considerations is that I won’t be able to gain as much capital/save as quickly as I am now. I’m itchy to leave North America so badly but also recognize leaving 200/250k on the table for about 100k is a potential future changer.
The only difference is I’ve spent a significant of time in Japan the last two years preparing for this. Traveling Japan is VERY different than living there. If you have your company that’s helpful but day to day live gets mundane and studying language while working a full time job is super difficult (I did this for 6 months). I’ve decided the move is in fact a good direction for me, but I have pushed it to Q1 2025. I wish you the best of luck!
I’ve been in your position, I took the jump and loved my time there. For me, it was definitely worth the additional savings I would’ve made. You’re young now, so it’s easy to do this kind of thing. Don’t let the opportunity pass you by if it’s something you want to do.
Hey Mate, here are my two cents:
**Financials**
1. ¥15M is a lot but if you are making ¥36M in the UK you should at least consider ¥20M to ¥25M after taxes and you will take home about ¥1M which is a huge amount of money.
**Quality of life**
1. Tokyo is mostly safe, clean and fun. Public Transportation is awesome. Visiting here is amazing but living here is different. Taking the train everyday at rush hour is hard.
2. Health care is incredible.
3. Internal travel is easy and the country is beautiful.
4. Combinis are life.
**Possible challenges**
1. Language. Japanese is tough and without being able to speak fluently you will absolutely suffer some level of isolation. Yes you can stay in an expat bubble, but the isolation is real. People have their own lives.
2. Culture. There are MASSIVE culture differences and it takes most people anywhere from 1 year to two to really understand and navigate them successfully.
3. Isolation, there is no such thing as “western” company in Japan. All companies get Japanized sooner or later. The culture here is quite monolithic and complex and ends up seeping into everything, so you might be at an “american” tech company where the official language is english and you will find yourself asking why after 3 pm all meetings and conversations go back to Japanese, or why you are getting emailed PDFS in Japanese.
All in all, this would happen in a lot of places, this is not strictly a Japanese thing. But just keep in mind Japan is a conservative place, they are risk adverse, they value harmony not individualism, etc. There are great books that talk about the cultural differences. Maybe read a couple first.
One last thing, There are different phases of moving to a new place:
Honeymoon phase –> You are probably here.
Frustration
Homesickness
Negotiation
Adjustment
Adaptation
When moving to a new country I suggest to start with very low expectations and understand that you will get tired, you will get frustrated, but in the end its about what values are important to you. Forget a bit about money and focus on quality of life.
Um i took a big pay cut moving here, but i wasnt making near as much as you.
If i were in your spot, id wait, as happy as japan has made me, you seem like you got a lot going for you. Id hold out for a better offer.
Don’t do it. You will end up resenting you job for the simple fact that you will be doing (likely) more work for far less money.
This is a no go for me
I keep hearing how cost of living in Japan is lower, but it’s always compared to some of the most expensive cities in the U.S. I also used to live in Japan 25 years ago. Some things are cheaper, others are a lot more expensive. So I guess it matters what is important to you.
I’m in the same position but it would be a 30% drop. Still a very high salary but it certainly made me doubt I was doing the right thing. I’ll likely always be fine financially, and if I ever make this move it will be now or never, but it is not financially smart, especially since I could move elsewhere where it would be financially smart to move to. I’ve told myself I’ll do two years, visit all the places I want to and continue my hobbies there, then reassess if I like it enough to stay longer.
But whatever I do, I’m just glad to be getting rid of almost everything I own and get the hell out of Canada.
I’m in a very similar situation, except with maybe an 70-80% pay cut. I’ve actually postponed going for over a year now, but finally bit the bullet. It’s a very personal decision. For me personally, I need to make changes in my life, and I’d rather be pursuing my dreams and poor than rich and hollow.
You’re out of your mind, respectfully. Don’t do it. As someone who lived there for 11 years and is moving their family back right now, I wouldn’t live there again if you paid me. Especially for the money you make now, it’s not worth it. That honeymoon period wears off real fast.