Hi! So I know I can naturalize and become Japanese if I wanted to, that’s not the issue and I’m not seeking advice on that. I also know that if I do naturalize and become Japanese as an adult, I would have to give up my current citizenship, which is US citizenship, and that is where I want people’s personal thoughts.
I’ve spent the bulk of my life in Japan and plan to continue to live here indefinitely. My husband and I both prefer it here over anywhere else we’ve lived, and he doesn’t have any ties to the US.
It’s hard for me to let go of US citizenship though since I know how hard it can be to get a visa to live in the US. At the same time, US citizenship is starting to feel like a burden and also it feels life might be easier here if I have citizenship. And I understand the Japanese passport is one of the most “powerful” ones for visiting other countries.
What are people’s thoughts?
20 comments
I’d personally go for the PR, being a citizen basically has no advantages over PR except being able to vote, which might hardly an advantage depending on your views.
For me, I’m keeping my US citizenship until at least after my parents pass away. If/when they become ill and I want to spend time with them at the end of their lives, I want to be able to enter the US immediately no questions asked and stay for as long as I need without complications.
After that I’ll consider naturalizing. But I already have permanent residency so in theory I can live in Japan indefinitely no problem without citizenship.
There is at least one example of an American losing his naturalized Japanese citizenship because he did not renounce his American citizenship after he naturalized. He got caught out because of IRS bank reporting requirements for Americans, I believe.
I’m not saying you’re considering to keep both, but if by chance that thought crosses your mind, it does not seem like a good idea.
Well this is obviously a personal decision. I guess weigh the pros and cons.
The biggest pro I could see is not having to do two stupid sets of taxes each year and I guess having right to vote in japan for whatever that’s worth.
The two big cons that anyone considering long term in japan are if China ever decides to have some fun on the world stage this century we’re on the front line. America is very relatively safe from any kind of attack or invasion. A big point it was pretty untouched during the world wars.
The other is the declining population and amount of tax payers as well as its economy. The national debt is a big topic in America but Japan is much worse. I haven’t given too much thought into long term of this but others might be more informed.
I’ll probably keep US citizenship. I have PR now and it is good enough for me. As much as I love Japan, I don’t really identify as a Japanese person. I accept my foreigner status for the foreseeable future.
You’ve got PR squared away already?
US is definitely on the decline.
They tax you globally (if you make under 200k & aren’t in the US for longer than 42 days then this shouldn’t be an issue)
But have no doubt, they have the strongest military in the world. They also are one of the few countries that gives their citizens the right to bear arms. (Is not important now but may be in the future)
I’m in the same situation but don’t plan on giving up my citizenship
The Japanese passport is highly ranked, but hardly used by the locals most of the time. The US passport is also highly ranked and good for almost all popular destinations. Are you planning to visit the countries where a US passport needs a visa?
If some shit kicks off between China / Taiwan / Japan, you’re going to wish you had a quick escape to the US.
If you are planning to have a child/ children in the future, you should keep US citizenship so that the child/children can become dual citizens. It allows them to have more options in life.
If you already have dual-citizen kids and/or aren’t planning kids in the future then never mind.
Renouncing your USA citizenship is troublesome and expensive. You won’t lose your US citizenship simply by naturalization.
I know one American who gave up his US citizenship to become Japanese. In his case, he had a highly successful business in Japan (over a million dollars in gross income) and was sick of the double taxation. But he did wait until after the death of his father in the US. After that he saw no potential benefit to retaining US citizenship. He did mention to me that after he got his Japanese citizenship, he went to the embassy to turn in his US passport and they actually tried to talk him into keeping the US passport and dual citizenship “in secret” from the Japanese government. But of course he refused since his main goal was to ditch the US taxpayer status.
I’ve had the thought before but I’m waiting to see how pensions payout in the future. The US and Japan have a shared agreement with pension and social security so you could pay in here and collect in the US. I could be I retire in the countryside somewhere in the US or Japan. It’s a few decades away, so I’m not leaning one way or the other. As another commented said, it’s also nice to be able to leave and visit family if I’ll and not need to worry about visas, etc.
The citizenship is also helpful for your kids (if you have any) and their options for university, financial aid, etc in the future.
Bear in mind:
* Losing your US citizenship is a taxable event. You’ll need to pay capital gains tax on all of your investments as if you had sold them as part of leaving America.
* Especially higher income earners, Japanese social security benefits are a pathetic joke compared to the US ones, even after assuming a 30% haircut to US benefits after the trust fund goes broke. Make sure you understand how renouncing citizenship affects social security benefits (I have no idea), especially if you’ve accumulated any credits in America.
* It seems no one understands how US/Japan taxes work. **There is no double taxation**. You always pay each country for the money you earned on the country. Then, you pay the diff to whichever country would have taxed you more if you had made all your money in that country. So, in effect, you just pay the higher tax rate of the two countries. Since the US lets you exclude the first $100k+ from US taxes, in effect you almost certainly just pay Japanese tax rates on your income.
For passport stuff, does JP really unlock anything for you? Japanese can go visa-free to 151 countries; for Americans it’s 143. Japan gets you visa free to China (wouldn’t be surprised to see that go away as tensions rise, though), visa on arrival for India, and… You can go to Iran? But if you’re not East Asian and you show up flashing a Japanese passport, is that really going to go smoothly for you? You may well be in for more added headache than reduced headache.
And if you ever change your mind, eungh, going back to the US long-term will be a pain in the ass. Supporting aging parents, or long-term visiting your kid when s/he decides to live in America, or whatever — it all gets needlessly harder.
I just don’t see much upside to offset all the nuisances unless you think you’ll really get a lot of enduring emotional gratification from saying “I’m legally Japanese” or “I’m not legally American.”
I am European, so I don’t have FATCA to come haunt me, which surely would be a major reason for me to naturalise.
But looking at the relatively volatile political state of the world, I am glad to be able to choose where I want to live, and if things turned sour here or there, I could always bug out to where the danger is smaller.
And just in general, you never know what curveball life will throw at you in the future, so being able to move elsewhere without a visa-hassle could come in handy one day.
So I keep my PR as long as Japan doesn’t allow multiple citizenships.
I’ve been here over 15 years, have PR and it’s looking like I will retire here.
I see no reason to, nor any advantage to be had by naturalizing.
Things could change at any time and that’s a door I will never close as it would be exceedingly hard to reopen.
Am I wrong to think that as long as we try to revoke our US citizenship we are good? To my knowledge its costs a bit and a big pain in the ass to revoke US citizenship? I been toying with this idea since I haven’t even visited the US once in last 10 years and still have no plan to.
I’m thinking of naturalising, and I’m from the UK. If I were American and subject to your tax laws, I would have naturalised a long time ago 😉
Id get rid of US citizenship just to avoid dealing with the IRS every year
I too plan to remain in Japan, but I don’t plan to naturalize, for the reason you stated…. I don’t want to renounce my birth right for it. So PR will have to do for me.
However, I’m not a US citizen. If I was a US citizen then because I intend to remain here, US citizenship is about the only citizenship I would renounce due to the global taxation and PFICs