As it says in the title, coming up on my third year teaching English in China. I absolutely love the job and I know I want to continue teaching English. However, for a variety of reasons, I’m toying with the idea of moving to either Thailand or Japan, with Japan being my first choice.
I’ve read the FAQ, and a lot of the things already discussed are things i’m familiar with (dancing white monkey, co-workers using you for free English lessons, etc).
I have a few questions I was hoping you guys could answer.
1. Salary vs cost of living in Japan. In China I can afford basically anything I want and not worry about money. What kind of salaries can I expect to see?
2. I have a nice flat in China for a relatively good price. I don’t want to live in a place with rats or cockroaches and scrape by. Is this going to be a possibility living on a teacher’s salary?
3. How many hours can I be expected to work in Japan? My current job has 0 office hours, so I can literally finish my classes for the day and go home. In some cases i’ll leave and then come back. Is this a thing in Japan?
4. This one is less about teaching, but i’ve heard some wildly bad expat stories in Japan. Are expat communities really so bad in Japan? I’ve heard from 2 different people that expats are basically a menace in Japan, especially English teachers. I’m hoping this isn’t true.
That’s all for now. Thanks!
​
EDIT: Hi Everyone. Just woke up to find 41 comments. There seems to be some confusion surrounding question 4. I haven’t read any stories online, everything I’ve heard about expats in Japan came from people who worked in Japan and now work in China teaching English. 95% of the expats I’ve come across in have China been really great people so that’s why I decided to ask.
Thank you so much, btw. The responses have been great. 🙂
11 comments
Speaking from my own experiences (rant incoming):
-Salary is not great and You’ll likely be living in a tiny Leopalace apartment. Although cheap and cheerful you’ll probably be on a lot more in China. You have to be somewhat careful with money in Japan as taxes/rent especially after your first year will take off around 50/60% of your income with barely any pay rises.
-The ALTs (Assistant Language Teachers) I’ve met here are some of the most weird, socially inept and downright creepy people I’ve ever met. I’d estimate that 10% of the ones I’ve met are p*dos, whilst around 60-70% of them are here because all they want is a Japanese “waifu” and/or they don’t have a clue what they want to do with their lives and almost everyone has no social skills whatsoever. The amount of fights and awkward situations I’ve had because of them are endless. Hardly anyone tries to learn Japanese either. You’ll spot the ALT gaijin easily. They’ll be pointing to everything saying it’s “oishii” or kawaii” or complaining that no one speaks English here (The English proficiency is atrocious here even in Tokyo)
-If you’re serious about teaching,stay in China. The English education system here is so crazily flawed i don’t know where to start.
Japan is honestly amazing though and I’ve had such a good time but personally i think the other expat teachers ruin it. Money wise too I’d stay in China.
Good luck!
In Japan you can divide this in to categories, actual teachers and what is called “white monkey” jobs in China. Actual teachers make a decent living but it isn’t amazing. Somewhere between 4.5 and 8 million yen is the norm. The monkey jobs pay, at best, 3 million yen but average closer to 2.3.
​
Your questions:
1. Japan has high tax and social payments. Depending on your salary you can expect to lose 35% to 55% to tax, insurance and pension. If you are a real teacher, you will be mostly comfortable. If not, you will be living like the poorest Japanese people.
2. That is going to depend on where you are. In Tokyo you are going to need to spend at least 150,000 yen a month to avoid roaches, mold, and other issues.
3. Depends on your work. University jobs generally allow the teachers to do what they want between classes. Legit international schools are going to be a 8 to 9 hour day. (more on this later)
4. Fake teachers are a problem. Most of them were misled and scammed into accepting shitty jobs that isn’t teaching. This leads to a lot of hostility and mental issues. Add in the frat style drinking cultures and the problems multiply. Another issue is people believe that the fake teaching jobs are a way into Japan and get upset when they realize that it is a dead end that won’t lead to better opportunities. 80% of people that come her to teach leave permanently within two years. 98% are gone by year 5.
​
Legit, real teaching jobs require a masters degree. University mostly requires a PhD and published papers but will sometimes hire a person with a masters. International schools want a masters, a teaching license and some experience.
​
Now the part people are going to get angry about (especially the same two predictable users). Outside university and international schools there isn’t any real English teaching jobs. The vast majority of the “teaching” jobs are at for profit companies that are using your skin color to make a profit.
​
Two predictable people will try to say I am wrong. The first will be “guest” who is desperately trying to validate their existence in Japan. The other is Ms. Y who is pushing MLM style free seminars that promises “professional development” help to ALTs. Funny part about the seminars is all the speakers are from universities and international schools.
​
​
TL;DR: If you want to enjoy life and continue doing your current job, go to Thailand. Japan will only be equal to your current life if you are qualified to be a real teacher. Do not take an eikaiwa job. Do not take an ALT job.
​
Now I am off to my very fun 3:15am meeting!
​
​
​
Edit*********
Apparently people are too lazy to google “white monkey” and are offended because they are sensitive.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qi5JEZo2KT0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qi5JEZo2KT0)
Yes, English “teaching” is included in this category.
1. You don’t exactly make an impressive salary in either Japan or China. Teaching English is not a financially good job. That said, you will save a little bit more in China because the cost of living, taxes are lower
2. Apartments in Japan are modern (clean, no rats etc) but very small.
3. If you’re “full-time” that is not really a thing in Japan, you have to work the assigned hours
4. Eh, expat community is hit or miss. It’s probably larger than in China. I’ve found them to be worse in China actually.
What are the reasons you are thinking about coming to Japan?
Of the 5+ people with experience in China I’ve met interviewing for jobs in Japan, two were back in China within a year, and another two returned within two years. We’ve been basically locked down so I don’t know about the last guy.
I’m not in regular contact with any of them long term, but the two I had a chatty relationship with seemed happy. Most of them had experience in mainland, non-coastal China, with the one who was here for just months coming from Shanghai. The biggest issues were meetings which were compulsory regardless of their comprehension level (they weren’t lazy or failing to study, but some discussions were just over their heads) and how far their money (didn’t) go.
It would be more worth it to try and teach in South Korea, depending on your qualifications.
I think China is just a bigger market. You can improve your life more easily by changing within China. If you move to Japan, you might luck out, but the more likely scenario is that you’ll have to start over from scratch. Obviously, Chinese and Japanese are very different in both language and culture. You’ll be competing with very experienced people, of course.
1. Depends. What are your qualifications beyond having a bachelor’s and your teaching experience in China?
2. Depends, again, on your salary and your expectations. See #1.
3. ESID. Generally, the more you make, the less likely you can do your lessons and go home.
4. You’re ONLY going to hear the negative stories online. You may not have any foreigners in your life, depending on where you live, but I can’t believe I have to explain that there are many types of foreigner… TO a foreigner.
Japan is different from China. There are already a substantial number of English teachers living here that you will be in competition with, who are way ahead of you in that they already have teaching experience in Japan, a visa, and personal contacts – which as you probably are aware, is the best way to find a decent job.
Without those things, and without an MA or a teaching license that would enable you to teach at schools and universities, your only real choice is getting a job at one of the big chain ALT companies, like Interac, or English conversation school chains, like Aeon or Berlitz.
ALT and English conversation schools do not pay well, they are notorious for skirting labor laws, and they generally treat their employees terribly. And because they all have a set lesson structure that they force teachers to follow, you’ll have no opportunities to develop professional-level skills. This means that once you are in, it’s very, very hard to move up and out. You’ll be stuck making 250,000-300,000 for the duration, with no real hope of a raise or promotion or professional advancement.
You should understand that no one treats these jobs as a career. Most people who work as ALT and eikaiwa don’t consider themselves career teachers. It is just a job to enable them to live in Japan and make some money. It is possibly more money than they would make back home at a fast food job, but not by that much. Essentially, these are jobs for tourists who plan to eventually go back home and enter into a completely different feild – it is not a good path for a career teacher.
If you want to be a **career teacher**, if you take teaching seriously as a **professional**, then I would advise getting fully qualified with the goal of working in a school or university. Otherwise, you should look for a job in a country that has higher standards than Japan, and thus better and more professional working conditions. Which, by the way, is NOT Thailand, either.
TL/DR: I don’t recommend coming to Japan if you are serious about teaching.
China sounds extremely cosy compared to Japan. You will not find living/job/salary conditions as good as you have it in China
1. Salary 3million yen (177,000 yuan) per year is around average for an unqualified ALT. It is not a lot. White monkey jobs arent well paying the work load is light. The first year is low tax the second and onwards are painful. Interac pays two months in hand. And only 10.5 months a year.
2. It’s gonna be small. Houses here are small. Roaches are a problem, even in clean houses. It’s really case by case though. I used to live in a shit hole because my neighbour was gross.
3. Hours are low. You will be expected to work all of them though. No ducking out early. And they dont want you taking days off. Fair because summer is normally off.
4. Foreigners… Yeah some of them suck. You’ll mostly hear about the shitty ones online. But a lot of kids come out here as basically a gap year after university. They treat it like a holiday and act like uni-kids. There’s also a lot of weebs… Which is great. The good thing about weebs and uni-kid is that they tend to have a high turn over, people who have been here a while tend to be more chill.
All that said, other ex-pats here have generally been grand.
I’m very late to this thread, but you should consider applying for the JET Programme before the September deadline. If you get employed through JET, you basically work directly for the state. Your salary will be decent and you will have job security and benefits including paid leave, sick leave and bereavement leave.
I don’t have any experience living and working in China, but if you’re concerned about your safety and privacy, you should consider moving as soon as possible. You shouldn’t have to live and work with the constant fear of a government looking over your shoulder and restricting your access to information and resources.