(Sorry for my English, I am not English speaker)
I live with japanese husband, no kids. We are living together 10 years aprox.
He has changed job 1 year before and he is very busy. He left home for work at 9am and return home 12 nigth (job+nomikai) everyday. In weekdays we do not have time together, no communication. Only [Itekimasu ] and [Okaerinasai].
In weekends he said that he want a free day for him.
Today he left in the morning. He will go to spa with a friend (work) and return at night.
We only have 1 day for us. Anyone in same situation?
I am also full time worker 9am 18pm in japanese company ( normally no overtime).
I feel lonely. I would like to spend more time with my partner as before. Before changings jobs, we dinner together in weekdays every day. (home)
I think I prefer live alone with a dog than someone that I have no communication. Also I do all home cleaning, laundry, etc .
Anyone in same situation?
41 comments
Tell him you want more time together.
It’s sad, but all you can do is communicate openly and honestly with him about this. Hopefully he understands and can make some changes to keep you happy. If he doesn’t, you have to decide if that is the kind of marriage you want to have or not.
Who has a nomikai 5 days a week?
You sure he isn’t just drinking with friends or doing the whole フラリーマン thing?
On the day you have together, sit down with him and explain your feelings and needs in a very calm way. Give him a chance to speak. Remain solution-focused and don’t seek to place blame, speak sarcastically or return to the past.
Out of that conversation, you will get one of two things:
A way for you guys to move forward together.
A realization that it isn’t working out, and it’s time to find the right way to separate.
I think he is being selfish. Drinking with friends everyday after overtime is very rude, and then to say alone time but does that with friends but not you? Shocking.
Please think about your marriage seriously and if you need to be together.
For reference, my wife does overtime but only till she’s finished, then home maybe around 7:30 ish and we spend time on laptops separately but with each other or watch 1 tv show together etc. But we spend weekends together and holidays. Our house chores, no kids, are split 50% but admittedly she does most of the cooking.
To have constant nomikais every single weeknight week after week is not a thing here. Sure, some sales jobs are demanding and you need to out with customers 2-3 times per week, but every single night? (December and January can certainly be tough with all the bonenkai and shinenkai.) Even with occasional drinks with the colleagues thrown into the mix, would someone legitimately be out every night for weeks on end? Now post-pandemic, a lot of the “settai” culture has diminished somewhat. How does he function at work? And is he just crushing his sales numbers or what? And then he goes out all day on Saturdays, too. That’s a huge red flag. If I may be honest, have you considered that he may be having an affair? He certainly seems to have lost respect for you. You’ve been reduced to being a maid. Have the talk and set expectations. If you’re still not satisfied, consider the fact that you don’t have children and you may need to move on.
Sounds more like a roommate than a husband. But if you also work full time, then you should split the house chores.
And why is going to a nomikai every single day essential for his job? I don’t believe that, maybe he just likes doing that. I haven’t met anyone that does it that much, most people do it once or twice a week at most.
It is completely reasonable for him to want a day of the week to himself, and it’s totally reasonable that you want more time together with him. The issue is that HE doesn’t seem to want to spend more time together with YOU by relinquishing nomikai-time. The solution to that is that he needs to say NO to drinking with coworkers every night. Every night?? Are there really so many coworkers who he works with that are willing to do that?
He’s either avoiding you because he actually doesn’t want to spend time with you or he is being a little b*tch to office politics.
I don’t buy the everyday nomikai excuse. And asking for a whole day for himself on the weekends? I understand he needs time for himself but he has 48 hours free and he chooses to spend almost a third of them out with a friend? And no communication at all about the expectations on your time together?
I’m so sorry but either he has checked out long time ago and doesn’t care anymore, or he has another woman on the side. The excuses don’t even make sense.
Uhh, guys??
[https://www.reddit.com/r/japanlife/comments/1097nso/divorce_after_getting_permanent_visa/](https://www.reddit.com/r/japanlife/comments/1097nso/divorce_after_getting_permanent_visa/)
Who’s going to tell her 🙁
I can understand wanting a ‘me’ day every now and then – maybe one weekend day once a month? But spending a day to….go to a *spa* with *a friend from work*, wtf?
That’s not a ‘me’ day, that’s a ‘I don’t want to be at home’ day.
As others have said – have a *calm* conversation about what you want / need. Don’t blame, don’t talk about the past, don’t get angry. Explain that you want to spend more time together as a couple. If he doesn’t feel that way, you should be prepared to think about seperating. The only good thing here is that you don’t have children.
I have worked at big Japanese companies – *extremely* conservative Japanese companies, lots of nomikai, especially in front-office (sales) roles. And NOBODY went to every nomikai. NOBODY. Not the sempai, not the kohai. Nobody would refuse all nomikai, but nobody went to all nomikai.
I don’t care what company he’s at, I don’t care how junior or senior he is, there is ZERO chance he is *forced* to go to nomikai five days a week…and then go to a fucking SPA on a day off with someone from work? Not a chance.
There is even a *less* chance of having to go to nomikai with bosses or people from work – COMPANIES DON’T WASTE NOMIKAI MONEY ON STAFF.
This is still post-pandemic – many clients are still working remote, which has drastically cut down on even normal opportunities for nomikai (although it is gradually returning).
Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I’m sorry to say there’s a pretty high likelihood that he has someone on the side. Be mentally strong but firm in what you want / need out of the relationship.
Good luck.
Nomikai is a part of job yes. But not every day seriously. What, has he even benefited from doing this every day in his work? Promotion? Raise?
the man is cheating.
How do I know? Because this is the type of shit I say.
Check his pasmo
I think he is cheating. I’m from Japan and a lot of guy saying same things but actually cheating that’s why he never come back home.
Talk it out, the truth will literally put everything in light. Your happiness is priority. Don’t let yourself be unhappy
To be honest, you need to sit down with him and have a serious conversation.
I get that he may be under a lot of pressure at work, and maybe he feels that he needs to attend these nomikais to remain in everyone’s favor and succeed in the company. And that may be why he wants some time to himself on the weekend.
He may even feel that he is working very hard to provide a stable future for you.
However, NO job is worth sacrificing your relationship if you truly love each other.
Talk with him. Maybe he only plans to do this for a while until he gets into a position where this kind of constant nomikais and sucking up to the boss and customer everyday is not required so often.
He needs to understand how you feel and how this jobe is affecting things (it may even be affecting his health in the long run).
Hi OP, I’m sorry you’re going through a tough situation. My husband works as an eigyou of a japanese company and he doesn’t go to nomikai 5 days a week. December and January is busy with the bonenkai and shinenkai, but the rest of the months, not even once a week. Although when they have others coming from other branches/guests from abroad etc, the nomikais can be for a few days (2-3 days) in a row, but it’s very very rare.
With that being said, i would be very suspicious if he goes 5 days a week! And on a saturday to be with work friends… I’m sorry but i really think you should have a serious talk with your husband to tell him how you feel. And get that PR asap.
Sorry, but I think he is cheating. This situation has so many red flags. Any man who loves his wife would make time for her and would not go to nomikai so often. It’s even more suspicious since most companies stay away from those get together since the pandemic era.
Protect yourself and prepare for the worst. But like others said, communication with him immediately is most important.
I’m in the same situation. My partner works 8am-midnight 5 days a week and is on-call 6th day. It’s just “normal” for some careers. You need to build up another life with friends and hobbies.
It’s either gambling problem, cheating, or he doesn’t love you anymore… or a combination of all of those.
Hide an AirTag in his bag, car etc to see where he’s really going.
Try and check his bank accounts/credit card statements/Suica Card history etc to see what’s really happening.
An old workmate of mine got busted cheating when his wife waited til he was asleep, used his fingerprint to open his phone, and found all the incriminating evidence.
He’s clearly stonewalling you so…
If it ain’t illegal, it’s fair game.
I barely see my Japanese husband. He only comes home to sleep and that is only for a few hours too. He works as a keibin and he’s internally dead most of the time. No, actually, all the time. I don’t know if i got used to it or just gave up on him.
To be fair, that culture (work=nomikae) does exist in Japan still even though it’s becoming outdated since the covid-19 outbreak. My host father did something similar for years until COVID 19 stopped it. Also, he developed a medical problem and the doctor recommended him to stop drinking and suddenly no nomikae.
In the OPs point of view there is a lot to be angry or worried about. It’s definitely not normal for foreigners to get swept up in that culture so easily, so I am guessing the SO is Japanese. BUT she is taking the logical, thoughtful and sane approach to dealing with the issue instead of just throwing crap and yelling like my SO. Doing so makes him less want to come home and deal with drama, which further exacerbates the problem.
Try to make him want to come home. As others have suggested, have a serious conversation and enlist his help to ask him what YOU can do to make him want to be home more and that YOU miss him. Even though it is likely he is wrong here, don’t blame him. Try to solve it together with love, and explain that this is very important to you as you are lonely and hurting. A good husband will not dismiss his wife’s feelings so easily if approached like this. If work pressure is the problem, you can get a doctor’s note, or say wife needs help with xxx y days a week and no one will diss him for skipping out and being a good husband.
OP, this thread is just full of people that don’t full understand Japan’s work culture and are applying their own culture’s values to the situation. Get the opinion of Japanese people that will tell you the truth. Not your Japanese friends, but anonymous Japanese people.
Do you have any friends / hobbies?
I have found that in most successful relationships each partner has their own group of friends that they hang out with from time to time.
Part of your lonliness is from not meeting your husband, but also part general lonliness imo.
In a relationship, in general, Japanese or not, spending time together and communicating is what it means to be partners. If he doesn’t try to sit down and communicate or listen to your concerns is very selfish and uncaring.
He is doing nothing to make you feel comfortable or respected.
What he is telling are called excuses in all cultures. I would try one more day of a real sit down and talk on your “together day” or whatever. (He needs HIS day, what about YOUR day..?) Anyways… be prepared for the worst (divorce) and plan ahead.
Like what others have said, apply for PR. Find a new place to go, and cut all ties.
There ARE men out there who is willing to put their wives before work on certain days, who WILL communicate with you and listen to your concerns, and who CAN make you feel at ease and comfortable.
How he’s treating you is pretty awful.
I have had some similar experience and feelings as you. So your feeling is totally valid. I find it strange that nomikai is every night but every company is different. My company hasn’t had any nonikais since the pandemic started. However the important thing is that you should definitely sit down with him and tel him your feelings. It is not okay to just give a hello and goodbye greeting each day. And if he says he is busy, he is tired then you at most certainly tired too and want more. I can’t help feeling he’s lying about something so you need to sit down and talk. Sometimes with my partner I feel I do all the work and they only cook and we both have little time and they spend it just staring at their phone. But when I talk about it they listen and make an effort to do something together. If he won’t even try for you then there is a problem. I wish you the best.
I’m sorry to hear that.
Based on your story, we can only make assumptions and guessings without proof or evidence.
First, you should talk to him about what you think and see his reaction. I know it is difficult to say, but stay calm always, breathe deeply if you disagree, but talk peacefully. State what you think, and see if he responds logically and with interest.
If there is no open and honest communication with your husband about how you are feeling, if he can’t acknowledge that he has not been spending time together, then it is time to move on.
There are some scenarios. First, your husband may be cheating on you by giving sloppy excuses. I’d understand if such a pattern happened only once from Monday to Friday; in my experience, saying that he has to drink with co-workers is a red flag from Monday to Friday. I’ve talked to many people from different industries, and even in the entertainment industry, my acquaintances would only drink late every day from Monday to Friday.
The second scenario is that he may be gambling to relieve his stress, and many people actually do that in Japan.
The third scenario is one in which he no longer loves you, and I think his statements are unlikely to be accurate, even if he works for a black company.
Also, it is unfair for him to not help with the house chores, leaving it to you.
You may ask him questions about how you can help him, whether the previous situation could work, and if not, how long the current situation will continue.
If he doesn’t want to change, you are the only person who can change your current situation. Move on, and have the happier life that you deserve.
He’s cheating on you…
It sounds like you feel very lonely and disconnected from your husband due to his long work hours and lack of quality time together. Many couples struggle with balancing work and personal life, especially in Japan, where the work culture can be very demanding.
Have open and honest communication with your husband about how you feel and how you can work together to improve your relationship. It may be helpful to schedule regular date nights or set aside a specific time each week for quality time.
Try to understand what is happening with him, whether he is no longer interested in a romantic relationship, he is really focused in his career, or he is facing any issues such as gambling etc.
Consider him seeking counseling or therapy to help improve his communication and work through any issues.
It’s essential to take care of your own emotional and physical needs. Consider finding activities or hobbies that bring you joy and fulfillment, and make time for self-care.
Try finding activities, hobbies, etc., that you could join together. Although it is not common, you can suggest him about joining activities with his friends or colleagues, and vice-versa.
It’s also okay to set boundaries and ask for help with household chores if you feel overwhelmed.
Every relationship is unique, and what works for one couple may not work for another. It’s up to you and your husband to find a balance that works for both of you and brings happiness and fulfillment to your lives.
Based on the facts stated, most of us probably feel there are a lot of red flags. However, we don’t know him, and why he behaves in such way. The situation in which he has to go for drinking with co-workers every night is not likely to happen every day. Also, saying that he is going for SPA with a friend, the chances are really low. Maybe in another universe, such unique situation might happen, but again, try communicating with him first.
If he answers you with disinterest, then, move on.
As someone that doesn’t drink, and if I were to drink I get gout, Nomikais sound very bothersome 😅
My father is very old (80s) and one of those traditional Japanese men, but he hated going to nomikais too since he didn’t drink nor smoke. That said, all he did was work, work and work and hardly communicated with his family at all. He’d be satisfied just reading a book in silence all day. It was only once he became very old that he’s now more open and openly showing emotions. I grew up overseas, so I always felt distant from my father because of this, my own father felt like a stranger to me. Communication is important. 😞
LONG READ— different perspective. Same thing with me and my husband, we’ve been together since 2015 and married for almost 4 years. If you ask him intimate questions about me I think he won’t even be able to answer. I used to have question nights with him so we can get to know each other in a deeper level than just okaeri and tadauma but after about 3 days he said he didn’t wanna share about his childhood or life before because it bored him.
If you asked me what he feared the most I won’t be able to answer too. He never goes out though, we’re both very introverted. Intimacy died too after we hit the one year and a half of being married— he was either too tired or too anxious about work. Last year, I watched Effie Grey and was struck with a question there. Who are you? Who are you when you’re not being his wife?
So I started a side gig about something I really love and since then I haven’t been THAT unhappy, I don’t mind the absence of intimacy as well anymore. I got depressed over the dead bedroom situation for two years and had massive hair loss, I lost a lot of weight too form the emotional and psychological damage of not being wanted by your own husband.
Then when my father died I had an epiphany, I realized I had to choose myself, I don’t think my dad would be too happy to see his only daughter in that situation, so I detached emotionally from my husband( best thing I’ve done in my life)—I don’t think he cared enough to realize it. He was actually happy when I stopped trying— when I no longer talked much, gave effort or asked for a hug from time to time.
I realized I can’t keep falling in love with the potential of a person and start seeing them as they are. I guess it’s both a gift and a curse to have your partner not care about you at all— you’re free to do whatever you want and actually have the time to do it but if you’re looking for butterflies in your stomach kind of romance I don’t think a lot of Japanese men are built for it. If you can make peace about it like I did, then find yourself another thing to focus your attention on. If not, then actually ask yourself if this is what you want out of life.
My husband and I have come to terms that we are good business partners and roommates and I’m 28, he’s 35 but we’re already too tired to enter the dating pool again so we’re just staying together. We’re deciding to be childless too and just get a cat or a dog. I don’t think that raising a child in a home where parents only talk about investments and business is gonna do a child any favor.
Since coming into terms with it, I have taken care of my well being more too, I started going to the gym again, reading self help books, educating myself in other languages, living my life for myself, booking dental, skincare, and spending money on myself too, my husband also helped me increase my income stream from 1 to 4 streams now (we actually are VERY GOOD business partners).
Do I miss romance? YES, I’m an old soul, book reading, romance loving person but then again, I have come to terms with it. I think I accepted my husband as who he is than the idea I had of him inside my head and I’d rather stay here— where I can sleep at night not worried if he’s cheating on me— we never fight too and he makes me feel safe— as a friend does.
Sometimes men would hit up on me and it’s makes me wonder from time to time how to be loved like my father loved my mom but then last night I looked at my husband sleeping beside me— I thought to myself that he’s a good provider, he never raised his voice at me even in anger, never raised his hands too, he actually spoils me with gifts (his love language) and helps around the house everyday.
If not for the absence of romance and intimacy we actually have a good relationship together. think I won’t trade my current life now for anything else. I’ve been in toxic relationships where I cry myself to sleep. I will never want to experience those again. Then again, just my POV. I hope it helps OP.
With my experience living here and dealing with Japanese their concept of marriage can be quite different from other countries. I can’t say 100% for your situation but JP men and women do fool around a lot. If you are splitting the bills and no kids and he still out this much either is fooling around or he really has a black 企業 job or a mix of both. You really have to assess your needs and try to look at your relationship objectively as possible. Do you two have a healthy sex life? Does he seem very distant? If not hmmm 😢
I don’t want to jump to conclusions but your story sounds a little suspicious to say the least and I’ve heard this one many times before.
My Japanese company only does nomikai twice a week. What the hell.
It’s not good for his health all that drinking. Perhaps angle the conversation on that aspect first and then, hoping he’s more receptive given your concerns for his health, explain how you do want to spend more time together and do fun things together!
Relationships are really hard and need a lot of work. Best of luck!!!
It’s part of the work culture, it looks like your husband is actively seeking to be promoted. If he refuses, he is considered not one of the team, doubly so if he is Japanese.
I have taught hundreds of Japanese students online across a decade. These are Japanese people from all the industries under the sun, but I can say for sure that I have never met a single student who had to go to a nomikai every day. Sure, some students were being overworked and that affected their family life. But definitely not an everyday nomikai kind of situation. Perhaps that does exist somewhere, but I’m sure its in the minority, especially with how strict and reinforced labor laws are now (could use some more work, but definitely better than before). Plus drinking alcohol in general is falling out of favor in the current generation.
I don’t know you, but I know it must be scary to have a conversation about this with him. What if your worst fears turn out to be true? I’ve been in a similar boat. The worst you can do is to never have that conversation( or series of conversations, sometimes it takes several times). It will eat away at you, eventually destroying your mental health. You don’t deserve that.
Welcome to Japan. Hell.
Demand therapist or couples counseling to be involved. It could unfold into serious marriage endangering stuff if work addiction is present. You will do it for both of you, it’s love and should be alive.
Love language.
Each culture has a different love language. In a lot of cultures women feed their men delicious foods, taking all day to make a perfect dinner or special treat that shows their love. Sometimes women carry this to extremes – if you’ve ever tried to refuse another plate of something from an Italian grandmother you’ll know what I mean.
In a lot of cultures men work to show their love. In many cases they’ll work crazy hours trying to get that promotion that will show how much they love their wife. Again, this can be carried to ridiculous extremes, like karoshii (death by overwork). But in Japan this is how men show their love traditionally. Fortunately a lot of younger men are waking up to the fact that it is better to actually spend time with their spouse, but it is still a prevalent idea.
Stop for a moment and consider how you would feel if you spent the whole day preparing a delicious treat for your husband, and he sat down and then complained the whole time about the meal. You’d feel angry as hell, and you would probably not talk to him for a day or so.
Now consider how your husband might feel if he went to work for 12 hours, endured another 3 hours of drinking with people he’s been around all day and doesn’t like very much, all because he wants to work hard for you… and then comes home and finds you angry. And he doesn’t understand why.
You have different love languages. And you’re not communicating. Perhaps it is a language barrier, perhaps it is just that he’s avoiding you because you’re always angry, and he thinks he is trying his best to show his love for you in the way he saw his father do.
You need to sit down. You need to talk honestly and openly, but more importantly you need to listen and understand that what you’re dealing with here are deeply rooted cultural ideas that he may not be able to clearly express without a lot of thought. They’re things that just “are”. Like the Italian grandmother who expresses her love by feeding everyone, if you asked her why she does it she’d probably be unable to clearly say why she’s doing it.
This isn’t one conversation, but rather a dozen conversations where you slowly “peel the onion”. And you need to be prepared for a lot of anger to come out in the process.
Now you think you’ve done nothing wrong. That isn’t quite true. You’ve done nothing **deliberately** wrong, but your husband may legitimately and fairly feel angry over how you’ve been behaving, because from his perspective he’s been working his butt off and you’ve been projecting hostility.
You need to be prepared for that anger, to understand that this isn’t a one-sided “him bad, me perfect” situation, and that rather your husband has (from his perspective) been trying to show his love every day, and you’ve been throwing that back in his face.
Now this doesn’t make you a bad person. There’s been a miscommunication here. Rather there has been little to no communication. You both need to fix that. But understand that you need to approach this from the perspective that the blame here is pretty evenly split, and possibly there’s more blame to lay at your feet than his. If you approach this as if you’re the wronged party you’re going nowhere.
You should tell him your feelings. It’s not healthy to work that much either, I think . Japanese work culture is not healthy at all, there is barely any time for family during the weekdays which is stupid I think. You should ask him to try and come home earlier so you guys can have time together.