Studying for years, still struggling at N5

29 comments

1. I sympathise. The verb is Kakarimasu, how long does it take from home to work? I would say use weak points on your test to focus your study, and take lots of mock tests.

2. Get a textbook or other full course type product.

3. If you are struggling with n5 grammar you probably aren’t interacting enough with real Japanese to internalize some of the basic grammar. I’d try reading some easy kids books. おしりたんてい is a good series to cut your teeth on. I’d also recommend いきものの話25.

4. Even if you don’t know what かかります means, the structure of the answer is related to the structure of the question. Since they both use かかります it’s a pretty good guess that that’s not actually the answer to the question, it’s the part beforehand, 25分ぐらい. So which of the question words below has an answer like that? Well the くらい in both of them should suggest that it’s どのぐらい, which is in fact correct.

   Or you could eliminate the other options. Do they make sense meaning wise or grammatically?
   E.g. for どう: “How? A duration of 25 minutes.” どんな doesn’t even make sense grammatically because it modifies nouns, but it comes before a verb.

   Anyway, I guess my point here is that there may also be some test taking skills that you could benefit from.

5. You need to learn more grammar?
   Studying Vocab only won’t get you anywhere. Focusing more on grammar might be appropriate for you. You will learn vocab alongside. Anki parallel is good

   I use a mix of bunpro/tofugo Wanikani and own Studying and also a private teacher.

6. “getting pretty sick of seeing people become fluent after sniffing a bowel of ramen.”I think you are greatly mistaken and just frustrated with yourself.Nothing comes easily to people.It’s about studying smarter not harder.It’s useless knowing thousands of words and hundreds of Kanji without understanding any grammar, conjugation etc.

   What I would recommend is that you pick up a grammar book like Genki and work through that.If you can’t afford Genki, there is also Tae Kim , Imabi and Wasabi.

   [https://www.imabi.net/hodokurai.htm](https://www.imabi.net/hodokurai.htm)

   [https://www.wasabi-jpn.com/japanese-lessons/japanese-grammar-exercise-wh-question-dono-dochira/](https://www.wasabi-jpn.com/japanese-lessons/japanese-grammar-exercise-wh-question-dono-dochira/)

7. Seems like you need more vocab. That’s definitely a vocab question and かかる and all the answer options are all very common everyday words.

8. If you’re an app learner and struggle with textbooks (like I do), give Bunpro a shot. It’s made a massive difference in my grammar learning!

9. Take classes, study the language the way most people study languages – with a teacher and a text book.

   Use Anki or whatever in addition to that.

   It is considerably harder to do only self-study than to attend a class. It’s like if you have a personal trainer in the gym – they will help correct your pronunciation (or in the gym case posture / form) and guide you to which exercises work well etc. etc.

   In a class you will be forced to do the slightly uncomfortable task of speaking to other people in a language you are not good at *yet*. That helps immensly on learning.

10. Have you tried… reading? Pick up a picture book, the basic grammar will stick real quick.

11. sounds like what your doing isnt working. why dont you take a break and actually engage with some japanese. how about watching some 実況プレイ on youtube

12. Hey man, I can share some resources for you if you’re serious and wanting to learn. Getting a bunch of vocab under your belt is great but if you aren’t reading then it’s not gonna do you a ton of good. Being consistent and layering your study with native material is the way to go.

13. Others have said it, but anki is not a holistic language study program. Anki is a tool for learning items. It is best used to supplement a structured language learning program like a class or text.

14. I suggest you go find the Master who made those kind of magical ramen bowls (or the ramen noodle itself :D). Then learn from them

15. Unpopular opinion: why don’t you try taking the N4 and N3 practice test too?
    I’m not suggesting it because I think you can or cannot pass it, it’s only for you to establish a sense of how Kanji is incorporated in the text and what kind of questions to expect, when you are solidifying a plan to study from this point onwards.

16. You honestly know *too much* vocab and kanji for your relative skill level. Like… **WAY** too much kanji.

    Knowing a lot of vocab and kanji is not a bad thing – on the contrary, it will drastically speed up the time it takes you to learn everything else. However, at this point, you are spending a large enough potion of your time studying those that it is detracting from your other studies.

    You can memorize the entire dictionary, but that doesn’t mean you can speak the language if you don’t know how the grammar works.

    > Lot word know, grammar not know, sentence appear this.

    That “sentence” is the sort of thing that a large vocabulary with no grammar will yield.

    –

    If you want to get to the level where you can pass N5, finishing the Genki I textbook is a reasonable benchmark to gauge that process. It’s not exactly one to one, but the level of Japanese that you have when you finish Genki I is *roughly* equivalent to the level you are expected to be at to pass the N5 exam.

    Full college courses get through the textbook in 2 semesters, or about 9-ish months. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with taking it at a slower pace, but if you want to improve more quickly, that is the general speed that it’s taught in schools.

    I would recommend you try to replace nearly all of your vocab and kanji study with grammar study – not permanently, but at least in the short term as you work to catch your grammar level up to your vocab level.

    –

    > A:　うちから会社まで＿＿＿＿かかりますか。 B:　25分ぐらいかかります。

    > どのくらい / いくら / どう / どんな

    I’ll break this question down piece by piece:

    うち – home – vocab

    から – particle meaning “from” or “origin” – grammar

    会社 – company – vocab

    まで – particle meaning “to” or “destination” – grammar

    かかる – “to take” (usually used to mean “taking time”) – vocab

    かかります – polite form of かかる – grammar

    か – question particle – grammar

    25分 – 25 minutes – vocab

    ぐらい – about – grammar

    どのくらい – “how much (time)” – grammar

    いくら – “how much (money)” – grammar

    どう – “how (is it)” – grammar

    どんな – “what kind” – grammar

17. I sympathize with you as I sometimes feel like I’m not as fluent as I’d like to be relative to how long I’ve been studying. But to echo what others have said, what I realized is that consistency is extremely important. For me anyway, I’m better off doing a little bit, even 20 to 30 minutes, every day, versus sporadically a couple of days a week.
    My suggestion would be see if you can go for a month or even two, and study every single day, whether it’s flashcards or whatever you’re working on. See if that makes a difference.

18. It’s a tough slog, I’m with you. You figured out the question and your problem solving technique is key to the N5 test. But ikura is usually for money or things, and donokurai is for distance or time. I personally made the effort to memorize question words early on in my journey, as I think they are one of the most important components of communication.

    I recommend Bunpro app if you don’t already use it. Just blast through all of the N5 lessons in a week or so and complete daily. Don’t “undo” any answers you get wrong unless you genuinely typo. You’ll get the basic N5 grammar down in a few weeks.

    The difficulty is juggling it all. I’m a slow study so it takes me 2-3 hours a day to study what some dorks on here can study in 1hour or less. It sounds like you’re the same as me. Do you have that time? If not, you’re gonna be struggling for a while.

19. I’d been studying casually (mainly Duolingo) for years and hadn’t really reached N5 level when I decided in August it was time to push myself. I skipped the N5 exam and went straight for N4 in December, studying both N5 and N4 grammar along the way. I used various things, this isn’t an exhaustive list, but the three things that helped me the most were

    • N5 (and then N4) bundle from thejapanshop (really helped with grammar)
    – used the vocab Anki deck as it was
    – made my own Anki deck with cards for each point in the grammar pdf

    • got a list of all the verbs I needed to know (yes these aren’t exact) and used a spreadsheet to apply the rules for conjugation into all the most common verb forms (informal and formal past, negative, volitional, conditional and て form etc), then imported that to another Anki deck with cards for each form. So I could quickly conjugate from the English verb to a particular form in Japanese, which helps with recognising the verbs in any form in questions like OPs as well.

    • used the Migii JLPT app to do a lot of practice tests

    Now I’ve passed the test I’ve added in Satori Reader and Nihongo con Teppei podcast to improve my reading and listening skills (also the stories bundle from thejapanshop), keeping a diary in Anki (and physical form) to build my writing skills and plan to get a private tutor to work on speaking skills. For me the main point of passing N4 was to get a good start on the basics of vocab and grammar quickly so that I don’t have to start from zero when I get a tutor.

    Hopefully some of the things I’ve mentioned here will help you. Best of luck with your Japanese journey.

20. Finish Genki if you want to progress.

    This kind of question the trick is, they want you to ask it using the same kind of pattern they answered the question in.

    So since they answered with ぐらい they want you to ask it with どのくらい so that the question and answer have the same kind of feeling to them.

    IDK why they always do that but it’s a thing to just get used to.

21. Are you doing all the genki material? Like workbooks? I use MNN and doing the workbooks helps a lot.

22. Thank you all for your replies, I am currently working through them and ingesting all the suggestions.

23. I find textbooks to be horrendously boring, and I’ve purchased a few video lessons but they are also difficult to maintain interest in them as the actors are terrible and the material themes can be dry (“what do I buy Ann-San for her wedding” or “how do we sort the garbage correctly?” Kinda stuff).

    If you can afford a live class or something on Udemy that might be up your alley.

    I find changing the mediums often as long as your still studying the same level material should be suitable. In other words I get bored easily and try every resource I can.

    Currently I am using Wani Kani and Bunpro back to back. These platforms don’t feel like studying for me so it’s less of a chore. Furthermore they limit your progress so you’ll know when to take a break. Although this is not the most intensive method it works for me at a pace I feel comfortable.

    If you can practice that twice a day you could roughly get about an hour a day. Furthermore you could immerse by using media in Japanese. You won’t understand much but over time your listening and reading will get better.

    You can’t swim unless you jump in the pool. Anyways I hope you reach your goals, and remember we are human, setbacks are normal. It’s about getting back up and trying again. Finally keep in mind the N5 you only need like 33% on each section to pass, so that practice test may not be a good indication of how you’ll actually perform

24. I think you need some structure and would recommend a textbook like Genki. Get an older version if you want to save money. You can use the online exercises in the link below. Don’t get buried in 100 different resources.

    [https://sethclydesdale.github.io/genki-study-resources/](https://sethclydesdale.github.io/genki-study-resources/)

    Japanese grammar is so different from English grammar, you need to drill “model sentences”. Pick one for each point and read it aloud several times. Try reciting it without looking at the book. Try writing it out a few times.

    I made a notebook with one model sentence per grammar point. It has coloured circles & squares, coloured highlights, and brief description in the right margin.

    Some Japanese teachers told me westerner beginners should be memorizing model sentences. That will generate a lot of discussion here. Regardless, I think you need to actively learn grammar points and fully understand them; I don’t think passive grammar study works for many of us.

25. The best way to improve at something is by doing that specific thing. If you want to learn how to read written Japanese you need to start reading. If you want to be able to understand spoken Japanese you need to start listening. You might consider watching Japanese TV shows/anime with Japanese subtitles to get both of these things at the same time. Don’t expect to improve significantly in any area you don’t actively practice in.

    Flash cards are a nice supplement to your primary studies, but they’re indirect and can’t account for the massive amount of contextual info in language that can’t easily be put into words. They should never be more than a supplement unless you’ve just started learning.

26. Could it just be that the mock N5 test that you’re taking has the actual question missing?

    There should be a description of the task like “Read the dialogue. Into ____, write the answer that fits best out of options a,b,c,d. Kudasai.”
    (That description would be in Japanese of course.)

    If the problem is grammar, try Bunpro.

27. Watch Japan From Zero video series on youtube. George will make it easy to understand and build practical Japanese up to an intermediate level.

    He often talks about exactly what you described in your post. Anki is a good supplement but you need the adequate foundation and to understand how the actual language works IN CONTEXT.

    Their new website fromzero.com is also really good.

    Don’t give up!

    Edit: I want to add that I consider myself new and between n4-n5.

    The question you post is exactly explained in the from zero series.

    Its asking from home up until X( i dont know those kanji but assume its work or some destination) _____ how long does it take. かかる conjugated to ri mas form and ka do the question
    You need to know how mada and kara works, and donnokurai

    I think the right answer is どのくらい which means about how much.

28. I’m sorry I’m a beginner and I probably shouldn’t speak but I would recommend watching Japanese Ammo on YouTube. If you are having grammar issues the absolute beginner playlist will do wonders for you.

29. Learning a language isn’t a “three afternoons a month” project. It’s a 2+ hour a day project. They don’t have to be hard, brain-melting hours but they do need to be consistent.

    Successful ramen-sniffers have sniffed a lot of ramen.

    Anki is excellent for reviewing vocabulary and interesting sentences. It can be mildly abused to cram new vocabulary. But it can’t teach a language because (even worse than Duolingo) it presents the language chopped up into little chunks with no logic or story connecting them. Your brain doesn’t get a chance to see the bigger picture.

    And that’s why you can’t answer a question like this which requires a bigger-picture awareness than single words. Sure you could try “test-taking skills” and thinking it through, but language isn’t supposed to be something you think *about,* it’s something you think *in.*

    This is why fiction is good and I want to get you into it. Textbooks can be okay, but they’re only a stepping stone. Some kinds of non-fiction are terrible (abstract arguments, business and political news) others are more beginner-friendly (how-to, how-it’s-made, video-game commentary, probably sports commentary if you’re familiar with the game).

    If you can get inside the story, events, procedure, etc. then the language pretty much just teaches itself. *But* a deeper problem here is the inconsistent time you’re putting in. I’d guess there are three likely causes:

    – maybe you don’t understand how much time is needed (3 hours a day is a good benchmark)

    – maybe you’re bored by the textbook (change how you use the textbook, change textbooks, include other activities, or completely switch to other options — being consistently bored isn’t your fault, it means you need to change something)

    – maybe your life is too busy and stressful for a new language (we often switch most of our recreational time to the new language)