Leaving Japan or no… Be harsh to me

38 comments

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2. A career in art is going to be a struggle no matter where you go. Have you looked into other fields? If staying in Japan is so important to you, you should look into other jobs you might be able to do (likely won’t pay very well, but they will keep you alive at least). Have you ever tried selling your art as side income, or doing commissions for extra cash? Finally, it’s important to remember that a lot of the things you like about Japan can be found elsewhere, with a little extra effort. I miss being able to go to a record store and find my favourite Japanese bands, but when I left Japan I took the CDs and merch I had with me, and can still import them if I’m desperate for more. No one can say whether you’re mental health will improve if you go home, but if you’ll have more opportunities there than Japan, it’s not like you’ll never get to enjoy the things you liked about Japan again.

3. Japan is honestly a lonely place. I was brought here by my Japanese husband , and never felt the feelings I’ve had here. I’ve lived in Russia, I’ve lived in France , but sheesh the social isolation and rejection and xenophobia here is something else.
   I’m only writing this to let you know there’s nothing wrong with you at all.
   I’ve recently come back here after a stint in my own country and if anything its gotten worse. I’m taking tentative steps to move back to my country for good, but will always need to keep my hand in here due to certain connections and obligations I have

4. Kind of sounds like you should go home.

   The reasons you listed for wanting to stay, they just don’t seem strong enough. Liking the cafes, snacks, cute characters, and music? Those things exist everywhere and are hardly a good reason to move to a different country.

   I also don’t think that people are refusing to show you their art because you’re a foreigner. It sounds like they just don’t want to show you their art and there’s nothing wrong with that. You mention that it’s hard to connect with your peers so I imagine they don’t want to show their art to someone they don’t really know well.

   Furthermore, I’m not sure if you understand Japanese culture when you call the people here “individualistic.”

   On top of all of that, if you came to study art, you’re going to need to understand that having an art degree isn’t going to produce nearly as many job offers as other areas of study in every country. You cannot blame the fact that you’re a foreigner in Japan on that. Yes, jobs in Japan generally require a high level of reading and writing in Japanese, but it’s still going to be difficult to get a job with an art degree anywhere, language barrier be damned.

   You can study art in your home country. I can’t say whether or not you’ll have an easier time but it sounds like you don’t really like Japan anyway. You moved here in the middle of a pandemic, which was just unfortunate timing, but it’s not the only reason you’re having a hard time here.

   You should go home, take a break for a while, get some therapy if you can afford it (or research healthy ways to cope with depression if you can’t afford therapy), then decide what you want to do later.

5. That’s a wall and a half of text.

   Just a few points:
   ・I don’t know how it is for the art industry, but starting your 就活 at the beginning of your 3rd year of uni sounds really wierd. My uni wouldn’t even let me start until the start of my final year, and everyone around me did that. We had the bulk of our credits in the bank so had very few classes, and spent the last year job hunting. My girlfriend at the time from a different university also did the same. No company is going to hold a seat open for you for more than a year.

   ・Don’t sweat the handwritten Kanji. I’m N1, have been in the corporate world for 7 years now, and you simply do not need it. There are better ways to spend your time, like working on your reading and speaking. Even natives can’t write that well anymore.

   ・On the Kanji again, what possible reason could they be giving you for that? Everything is electronic. Nothing handwritten is ever used externally. You sure it’s a requirement?

   ・Lastly, don’t feel so bad about your mental health. Shit happens. However, as a student you have it really easy right now. Unless you get lucky, the work culture is brutal over here. I don’t want to discourage you, but I would recommend having an honest conversation with yourself about whether you can handle it. There’s no shame in leaving if you don’t want to risk it.

6. hello! i’m a 3rd year university student here, also in an art-related major. i know a senpai who couldn’t secure a job before graduating last march because she started late as well, then she applied for a job-hunting visa, and few weeks ago she finally got hired as lead designer for a japanese startup company.

   even japanese students need to apply to 10-20 companies until they get accepted to one. most of my international student senpais applied to 30, even 50.

   you have to polish your portfolio starting from now, learn from past applications/interviews and reflect what went wrong. japanese companies hire fresh grad for their potentials, so you have to learn more about what you can give to the company, your strengths and weaknesses. ask for feedback and advice from your professors or friends or even strangers on reddit. i would say your career counselor was honest, but seems like they were being unsupportive as well. you definitely still have a chance until you graduate next year, just keep shooting your shot and try to level-up your portfolio + Japanese skill too.

   just my two cents though, i’m still a student in the process of starting job-hunting as well, so maybe other people here have better insight into this. but if you feel like your mental health is suffering so bad that you can’t endure the harsh process of job-hunting in japan, then i guess going back to your home country would be a good idea too. who knows, maybe someday in the future you’ll encounter an opportunity to come back here again, but for now it really depends on how much effort you’re willing to put into your last few months of uni.

7. Honestly, going home doesn’t mean you’re going home forever. A lot of people end up leaving Japan and then coming back in the future. You could go back home and take a year off or two. You’re still young. After, think about what you want to do. There are many ways you can enter Japan again and you can get hired in the future. Build up a portfolio, keep practicing Japanese, etc. and when you’re ready then come back.

   ​

   >Also does pursuing an art career in Japan worth it?? I heard they have low salaries and overtimes that is why my sis worries if I get a job there my mental health is messed up more.

   This is something you should really look into for sure. There’s no doubt that working in Japan, especially at a Japanese company, is going to be a lot harder than working back home. Do you need to work full time? This will depend on your financial situation as well. Can you get by working part-time at a company while you do some freelance work here and there and make enough to get by and enjoy Puroland every once in a while? Look over some of the math on this.

8. I don’t get the impression that your mental fortitude is sufficient to live in Japan. In a way, shukatsu is like a mental health check that you need to pass to be able to join the working force, and giving up after 4 rejections is **way** too early. It took me about 20-30 rejections before I got my job offer, and it is a major that is usually flush with jobs.

   Keep in my mind that just because you leave that doesn’t mean you can’t come back, but some time in your home country might do you some good to reassess.

9. >be harsh to me

   There’s a question mega thread three days a week, including today. Learn to read and ask there.

10. Hey, it’s okay to go home, regroup, study kanji, build your portfolio, and then come back.

    Leaving Japan isn’t the end. Just one step in the journey.

11. It’s a typical tactic in Japan to lay the blame back on the victim. There’s one rule is Japan: The system cannot fail, it can only *be* failed. Your counselor is full of shit. One advantage in Japan is you can get a job almost anywhere even if it’s unrelated to your experience. Try applying more broadly in field. Hell, even apply to home modification/reform companies and start out on 1000 yen per hour.

12. Go back home, recover, and plan your next move when you are 100% mentally and physically healthy. People here (especially in major cities) are individualistic and it will only intensify after you enter the workforce.

13. I don’t have an art background, but I am a professor and advisor to to 3rd/4th year students, and I was an international student and had many international friends who went through the shuukatsu process. What I’ve found is most people get a job eventually, if they stick with the shuukatsu’ing and don’t give up. Four companies isn’t a lot by any means. I’ve had students finally get an offer in March right before graduating–and not necessarily bad places. One student I had finally got a naitei at a Tokyo city hall as a civil servant in March–a very desirable position. Other friends graduated without an offer but did the job searching visa and got a position soon after. I’m not saying it’s easy. Shuukatsu is really draining and I wish the system were different. But if it’s what you want, then apply to places and keep on working on your portfolio and Japanese. Once you get an offer, you can keep on looking, too–it’ll be much easier mentally with something in hand. And once you do start working, you can always quit. A job opens up a lot of doors but the door doesn’t just lock when you start working.

14. I had to apply to 300+ jobs (yes, I counted) before finding one. It really is hard to look for one especially as someone with a foreign name. You have to keep trying

15. Go home. Most of the things you like about Japan can be enjoyed from a PC in your home country. Come out on vacation once in a while to enjoy the public transportation and cafes.

16. Without knowing where you’re from and what your situation was like back home, it’s hard to recommend whether you should go back or not. My gut says to go back home and reevaluate things, but maybe you’re from a war-torn country, lived in destitute poverty, have a terrible family, or some other major problem.

17. It feels like you should go home. I also love Japan and plan to retire there, but do not want to work for a Japanese company with overtime and little pay. My plan is get rich in the US (or another country) and retire in Japan where there is great food, cheap health insurance, great public transport. I love Japan, but feel that other countries have much more career opportunities. You can still visit Japan every summer or whatever to stay connected to the culture.

18. When reading your text it sounds like you expected too much from schools. You thought you would automatically socialize and become a professional artist just by attending classes. I also made that mistake about 10 years ago.

    Did a University exchange in Japan that had japanese students and exchange students separated in most classes, so if you were not highly involved in activities and always trying to engage with people outside of class, you just wouldn’t have many occasions to make friends. I was focused on having good results to graduate, so I just ended up spending all the year alone.

    This also meant that I had not been looking for work at all, so when the year ended, I just came back to my home country and enrolled in a Master’s degree in IT. There too I kinda thought I’d magically become some developer or UX designer by just attending classes, so the portfolio I had was limited to school work.

    This was enough to find work in my country, but when I tried to get back to Japan after 3 years, it didn’t cut it. Why ? Because I was just offering about the same as the average japanese applicant, with lower communication abilities and the burden of handling visas on top of it. I tried to buff my portfolio during the year I was job hunting, but of course it was too late : you don’t have time to do much when you have to prepare 70 job applications at the same time.

    I eventually found a good position with a bit of luck and after reconsidering the kind of job I wanted to do so I could make use of my experience.

    Tl;Dr : in your case, my advice would be to get back to your country, take a break to recover mentally, brush up your skills and get some work experience. Then come back to Japan with a killer portfolio, and get a better position than what you could have expected initially.

19. From the timeline I assume you are still quite young. You still have so many possibilities and choices ahead of you.

    Your family and friends are missing you and you are missing them. I would suggest to go back home with the successful achievement of having graduated here. Recover and get happier again, keep up the language studies, because they will benefit you in any case. Then when you feel like it, come back to Japan and pursue your further career here, if that still is your dream then! As for whether work life is gonna be more stressful: It really can go either way, depending on the company.

    I wish you all the best, congratulations on graduating during such a difficult time in a foreign country, especially with your diagnosis! And congratulations on sticking with life! You did well! Be proud!

20. As a creative, take advantage of this time before March to improve your portfolios, get advice about it from your teachers, and improve it even more. Your portfolio will be important no matter where you live. (And if it’s bi- or even tri-lingual, even better, imo.)

    Spend at least half your time soaking up everything about the Japanese art scene, and FIND people to share art with. They are out there! This will be useful whether you stay or go.

    Be sure to study kanji as an art form as well as a method of communication, too. Take outside shodo classes. Can you get a teacher’s qualification before March? Again, this can be useful whether you stay or go.

    Kanji as communication: my kids’ ds had a bimoji program, and I’m currently using Kanji Study for Android to study kanji. Quizzes on the pronunciations, key words and kanji combos as well as stroke order practice. You can make your own sets to study according to what you need to read this week. Or write, for that matter.

    Being able to make beautiful, meaningful kanji could be an unusual skill set in your country. A new viewpoint on old kanji could be an artistic asset here.

    Just keep your doors open. As long as you have a ticket back home, you can quit anytime and go back. So, why not try it just a little longer, if you can stand it? You’ll know when you are done.

21. A few things..

    It seems some of the reasons you listed for feeling uncomfortable here are things that most likely aren’t going to drastically change, not for the long term at least. Especially people being individualistic and not very deep. That’s probably my number 1 thing that makes it hard for me to be here, and my Japanese is good and I have a good number of close friends so that’s not the issue.

    4 companies isn’t much to find a job I think, especially if you don’t have experience and don’t know how to appeal for yourself that well. When I first came to Japan I applied to 14 places (some I was serious about, some just to see what happened), got interviews with half of that and maybe 4 or so became possible options. And I’ve switched jobs a few times since then and every time it’s a similar kind of process.

    That said, art jobs in Japan are pretty horrible unless you live and breathe art, and don’t desire to have much of a social life or do non-art related things outside of work (think about yourself 5-10 years from now). The pay is hardly ever decent, but it’s really demanding in terms of skill and professionalism. It really is a shame.

    But, you spent so much time here and like things about the culture. I feel it may benefit you to try to find a job somewhere for even just a year or so to grow a bit more and use what you’ve learned and experienced, enjoy things when you can, maybe make some good friends, and then work on going back home to where life would treat you much better, and you’ll be better off in the long run.

    At the end of the day your mental and physical health are more important than “making the dream happen”… and if neglecting that is necessary for the dream then it may be worth reassessing the dream. Maybe even just adjusting your goals a little bit.

    For reference I’ve worked in 3 design studios and have freelanced full time for 5 years here.

22. Honestly, I think you’re being too harsh on yourself. 4 rejections are nothing.

    And leaving Japan is not some kind of failure, by the way. It’s just an option, and depending on what you want to specialize in, your CV (having graduated from a Japanese university) is nothing special in Japan, but in your home country, this could be a novelty and could get your foot into a company’s door. I’ve heard quite a few stories of friends that have applied to companies in their home countries and how their experiences in Japan made them stand out. During interviews, their future boss would suddenly talk about how his kid likes “these Japanese games”, or about their time in Japan in the 80s, and it kinda melts the ice.

    The things that you like about Japan are fortunately not exclusive to Japan, there some other countries with similar qualities but different people who might be more compatible with your personality. Your reasons for staying aren’t that strong, for example you can import the books/snacks/music that you like (or buy them during a visit), and if you’re still not fluent, you’ll have to grind even harder now on top of catching up with your portfolio and job hunting. Ask yourself if you can do that from now on, every day.

    I was surprised about the ‘individualistic’ part though, or did you rather mean to say that people keep to themselves?

23. I’ll level with you.

    It sounds like you have family in your home country who loves you and cares about you. IMO, that is worth a lot more than being able to eat Konbini food and buy Sanrio stuff. You can always come back on a tour or even to live after you have your bearings.

    If I were in your position, I would consider asking myself:

    * Why do I want to stay in a country, different from my home country, where I don’t have a support network?
    * Do I have the resources and energy to learn about all of the boring parts of life again. I’m talking about taxes, learning new things, job interviews, retirement, budgeting, etc. from scratch, without the life experience of my family to lean on?
    * If I want to raise a family in the future, do I want to do it somewhere my childhood experiences will not help as much as they would in my home country?
    * If the worst case happens and either I or someone I care about am injured or sick, do I have the resources to find a way to help them from Japan or not.

    Living in a different country is much more than just minor lifestyle inconvenience. It’s a massive investment of time, energy, study, and resources both mental and physical because it will require learning the ins and outs of culturally appropriate behaviors, even if you disagree with them – because you aren’t living in your country. It requires engaging in life in Japan to ensure you understand what is happening to you to avoid falling for scams and other BS that would be FAR easier in your home country.

    I say this with the best of intentions. I didn’t recognize the commitment I really made to “live in Japan” until it hit me later in life and I’m struggling to achieve that. If I could go back in time, I might very well tell my younger self to just move back when he had the chance to do so. I do have commitments now that keep me here.

24. I think the question you should ask. Do you like your life here? Liking the music is whatever.

    I’ve been struggling for two years and when I asked myself that question I came to find out that I do.

    If you don’t then go home.

25. Here’s my take.

    Your post clearly shows you want to leave and Japan is not for you. Your reasons to stay are not good and you are struggling mentally to keep afloat so you should leave.

    If you must stay because you can’t find weeb stuff in your country get into construction like yesterday that way you’ll be able to develop real skills that can be traded for money. You’ll be employable for life. Your training will be paid and most companies will pay for your certs in Japan as well

    If you are not weak minded and soft bodied try to get into like graphic design or marketing where you art might be useful, you’ll probably need to take more classes though and waste more time training

    A harsh truth is that art is more of a hobby, and if you search the internet, art degrees are the worst degree you can get next to like history lol. To come all the way to Japan to study art was probably a dumb idea but life is about making mistakes and learning and trying again till you get it right.

    My original degree was hotel management (almost useless) and my hobby is hiking (who wants to pay me to climb mountains?) – so I’m not far off from you other than I didn’t come to Japan to start my career.

    In my home country I ended up changing careers to become a refrigeration engineer and i still hike often. Life did a completely 180 and if i go home I’m secure for life. In Japan i can still do the job if I want because aircon is everywhere here I just need to brush up my Japanese a bit.

    Anyways point being here is you should go home. I read a bunch of posts where people go home, level up and then come back to Japan successfully with good careers. You could also manage something like this and perhaps try again.

    Realistically you need a better skill that’s going to get you a real job.

    Also what did you mean Japanese people are too individualistic? That seems so far fetched, as it’s common culture here not to stand out – it’s like everyone wants to be the same for a strange reason.

    Good luck

26. 4 companies? Sorry to say this, but u should try harder. I did my job hunting same level with the locals during the lehman shock and i got rejected by like 200 companies (with a recorded list) and i finally got one job offer before summer.

27. The reality of it is, Art similar to Music can be very hard to find a stable job doing what you love.

    Tell me a bit more about your Art. Painting? Drawing? Historical painters and all about them? What do you do exactly in university? When you say you want to pursue a career in art, what exactly?

    You should focus online, graphic design, UX design building websites and applications. Figma for example is super easy to use with no code and you can design beautiful Apps and Websites. Good paying jobs! Art related. What about organising private tours of art museums or somewhere showcasing famous Japanese art?

    My experience is I studied music in college. Art and music go hand in hand. I quit because there were no job prospects with it. Now I’m a project manager for a sales company and I’ve lived and worked in Japan for years. There’s more to life that what you study in college.

    First and foremost, your mental health comes first! Plus, Japanese companies; the majority of them will just destroy your mental health.

28. Sounds like you will struggle to find work and be happy anywhere you go.

29. The better you get at handling rejection, the better your prospects are. Rejection is going to happen a lot. Need to take risks.

    4 rejections isn’t much yet. Keep at it.

30. I would say it depends on why country you’re from, originally. But, generally, if you can leave, do leave.

31. Art is mostly a dead end unless you got connections and good dick sucking skills or exceptional talent. Rejected by 4 companies? I’ve been rejected by more than I can count, here and at home. Your barometer is wacked on this. Things are not gonna get handled to you in the real life, and people are huge cunts at home too, be assured of that. You can fight more if you have the means, but without no certainty of success, or switch to a job that has maybe more opportunities. You need great mental strength, and be ready to be stomped on. All that pain will means nothing if you find something to live for in the end. Here are the 2 cents of a 38 years old failed film maker. In the end, unlike me, I hope you make it. It starts by acting and stop finding excuses, as your situation is not that desperate yet, even if the game is fucking rigged by design. Good luck.

32. I’d like to see some statistics, but I’d be willing to bet that the majority of people from the West that move to Japan, end up going home for good at some point. I mean how many old gaijins do you see? I know some exist but not that many.

33. You sound like an out of breath 15 year old. Besides that, just do whatever the fuck you wanna do. If you can’t decide flip a coin. If you don’t like the outcome of the club toss, do the opposite.

34. I’m not working in art domain, but having 4 rejection is not considered as a failure, at all.

    Even I, as a mid-level staff, needs 7-10 rejections before I was hired by my current company. And I consider it as a low number of rejection.

    I know you have a mental health issue.
    That I can’t comment on.
    It’s all depends on you, what you really want, and how hard you want to fight for it.
    And you need to remember, not every battle is worth the try.
    Leaving japan doesn’t mean you give up. It just means you want to explore another options.

    In my opinion, if you want to fight still, aim the lower company or startup company that has lower barrier to get hired. Even if the pay is probably less, but the experience does matter.

    Another option is if you can secure a job in your country, you can start your early career there and try Japan in the future. At the time, you already have the experience, hard skill, and the language advantages.

    🤞🏼goodluck!

35. My guess.

    1) 4 rejections is too early. Give it some more time. Hopefully you have spare time.
    2) You don’t go to uni to study knowledge or skills in Japan. The uni itself is the prize.
    3) As an artist, you probably will have to write Kanji as part of commercial art. If you can’t, that would be a problem. As you know, the aesthetics are Kanji are art in themselves. If you can’t join in with that, it may be a problem.
    4) As you aren’t native and don’t write Kanji, what do you bring to a company that they can’t get from the 10s of thousands of other graduate artists? That doesn’t mean you are not talented. But as a foreigner, why hire you over a Japanese graduate?

    That’s the critique. As advise for you. Try going for a job that requires your skills as a foreigner but it adjacent to the art you love. This may give you a foot in the door. Localization jobs are fairly common and there may be one for your native language.

36. Go home. You sound exahusted. And just at this time it seems you would need a lot of energy and resilience.

    Go home, charge your batteries, and come back if you want. Take it as a long vacation at home.

37. Japan isn’t for everyone. Even gaijin who can write Kanji perfectly (Chinese, Taiwanese) or have a leg-up in grammar (Koreans) can find Japan EXTREMELY hostile and exhausting to no end.

    Most non-Asian foreigners stand much less of a chance unless you happen to be extraordinarily talented, well-connected or super mentally resilient and tough in spirit. Let’s put it this way – there is a reason why Japan has maintained a 1 to 2% foreign population over the decades compared to some other places where foreigners can easily make up 30-50% of the population.

38. my Japanese girlfriend worked many years as graphic designer in various firms and also as freelancer. She does not anymore, due to the extreme long hours, stress of the art/design related jobs in Japan. I think your sister&aunt may be right, you need a real strong mental state to go into this not to mention the additonal, constant effort to learn the language and low pay, and low yen.