すみません -> excuse me/sorry すまない -> a casual form of すみません that I’m not sure is really used in real life.
Well, sumu 済む means *to end*, so when you say sumimasen, you don’t actually apologize in the sense of the English word, you actually tell the other party that *(your feeling of guilt or whatever about the thing you did) will not end* anytime soon. It’s just that *sorry* is the best translation for the same concept in English.
Best not to think of Japanese and English phrases always having a one to one correlation. As another poster has said, we translate it as “sorry” or “excuse me” because that’s the closest thing we have in our culture. But the literal meaning is different.
Plain form of すみません which means sorry or excuse me.
(私のら失礼な行為は)すみません。 I’m sorry the troubles I pose never end.
It’s saying sorry for admitting that you are always causing others problems.
Similar to the English expression, “It never ends with that one” as in, that assholes always causing trouble for everyone around him.
What do you think the ‘sen’ portion means in the formal variant?
The definitions (translated by me right now) from weblio, of 済む:
1. something ending completely 2. to pay off a debt fully 3. to fit within expectations or a certain limit 4. to feel content, or at ease 5. to have an excuse for someone
We can see that definition 5, when used in the negative, means, “(subject) does not have an excuse).”
So when used in practice, it’s: “I don’t have an excuse for [x].” = “I’m sorry for [x].”
Totsuzen o-jama shite sumanai. 突然お邪魔してすまない。 Sorry to bother you unexpectedly. (lit. “I have no excuse for bothering you unexpectedly.”)
(also you’d usually say すみません to be polite unless you’re with friends)
We only translate super literally for learning’s sake; we normally translate to the closest natural English equivalent, so don’t always rely on translation to teach you what the original Japanese means!
Just take it in for what it is. Because that’s what they chose for it to mean and it just stuck
[Disclaimer: I’m not a native speaker, but I’ve studied off and on for years. If I get anything wrong, I urge the reader to correct me.]
The words _sumimasen_ and _sumanai (desu)_ are the same, but spoken in polite and plain form.
The gist of it is that the polite negative suffix _-masen_ turns into _-nai (desu)_ in plain form.
The stem, _sumi-_, became _suma-_ in plain/casual form, probably because it’s softer/lazier, much like English _going to_ became _gonna_. I think they also made the suffix more casual by not voicing the trailing vowels so that you’d only say _suman_, but don’t quote me on that, I’m not sure.
If your question was simply about why both forms end with a negative suffix, then just consider that there are ways to express regret or remorse with a negative nuance, e.g. “this is not excusable”, “it should not have happened”, “I did not do the right thing” or “I cannot forgive myself”. Other answers here teach you what the literal meaning is, which is apparently that your efforts will not suffice or something. I don’t know the true etymology so I’ll leave that to them.
9 comments
すみません -> excuse me/sorry
すまない -> a casual form of すみません that I’m not sure is really used in real life.
Well, sumu 済む means *to end*, so when you say sumimasen, you don’t actually apologize in the sense of the English word, you actually tell the other party that *(your feeling of guilt or whatever about the thing you did) will not end* anytime soon. It’s just that *sorry* is the best translation for the same concept in English.
Best not to think of Japanese and English phrases always having a one to one correlation. As another poster has said, we translate it as “sorry” or “excuse me” because that’s the closest thing we have in our culture. But the literal meaning is different.
Plain form of すみません which means sorry or excuse me.
(私のら失礼な行為は)すみません。
I’m sorry the troubles I pose never end.
It’s saying sorry for admitting that you are always causing others problems.
Similar to the English expression, “It never ends with that one” as in, that assholes always causing trouble for everyone around him.
What do you think the ‘sen’ portion means in the formal variant?
The definitions (translated by me right now) from weblio, of 済む:
1. something ending completely
2. to pay off a debt fully
3. to fit within expectations or a certain limit
4. to feel content, or at ease
5. to have an excuse for someone
We can see that definition 5, when used in the negative, means, “(subject) does not have an excuse).”
So when used in practice, it’s: “I don’t have an excuse for [x].” = “I’m sorry for [x].”
Totsuzen o-jama shite sumanai.
突然お邪魔してすまない。
Sorry to bother you unexpectedly.
(lit. “I have no excuse for bothering you unexpectedly.”)
(also you’d usually say すみません to be polite unless you’re with friends)
We only translate super literally for learning’s sake; we normally translate to the closest natural English equivalent, so don’t always rely on translation to teach you what the original Japanese means!
Just take it in for what it is. Because that’s what they chose for it to mean and it just stuck
[Disclaimer: I’m not a native speaker, but I’ve studied off and on for years. If I get anything wrong, I urge the reader to correct me.]
The words _sumimasen_ and _sumanai (desu)_ are the same, but spoken in polite and plain form.
The gist of it is that the polite negative suffix _-masen_ turns into _-nai (desu)_ in plain form.
The stem, _sumi-_, became _suma-_ in plain/casual form, probably because it’s softer/lazier, much like English _going to_ became _gonna_. I think they also made the suffix more casual by not voicing the trailing vowels so that you’d only say _suman_, but don’t quote me on that, I’m not sure.
If your question was simply about why both forms end with a negative suffix, then just consider that there are ways to express regret or remorse with a negative nuance, e.g. “this is not excusable”, “it should not have happened”, “I did not do the right thing” or “I cannot forgive myself”. Other answers here teach you what the literal meaning is, which is apparently that your efforts will not suffice or something. I don’t know the true etymology so I’ll leave that to them.