Been here a while now, and am more or less an alcoholic. Every event you have with coworkers, everytime your friends invite you out, everytime i finish work and pass a conbini on the way, i indulge.
Ive had some great times here drinking with people. Met a lot of friends because of it. And also gotten some opportunities from it through meeting and socializing with new people.
Thing is, i hate it. I don’t know when to say when. But there doesnt seem to be any other way of relieving stress after a busy day, or for lack of a better word “unwinding”. Seems like a huge part of Japanese culture is intertwined with drinking, and im genuinely at a loss for how to spend my Saturday and Friday nights if i don’t join in.
People who have broken this trend, how did you do it? I think the most obvious answer is gonna be “hobbies”, and i have those. But when i finish work, and walk home in the evening, passing by the hundreds of Japanese folk frequenting bars and getting pissed, seems near impossible not to join in with the crowd. What alternatives worked for you?
32 comments
Going for an MRI and finding a lesion on my liver sure put a stop to my occasional drinking pretty quickly. The liver does about 200 different jobs or so I’ve read so it’s best not to abuse it.
I’m sure it’s difficult but some things are too important to be overthrown by peer pressure and the like and other people will have to understand that you don’t want/can’t do the norm.
Replace it with water and pretend it’s shochu.
i have friends who join nomikais drinking oolong cha while designated drivers drink non-alcoholic beers
I love my job, and I like hanging out with my daughter. I still go to all the work parties, I just say that I have to drive and everyone is chill about it.
I never really feel stress I think is the biggest part.
Naltrexone, sinclair method.
There are so many things to enjoy in life without having to drink alchohol, just do that and you’ll be fine. I’ve been to plenty of friend/company/whatever gatherings and never “forced” to drink anything other than tea or orange juice.
I’ve found people in Japan to be very understanding when I tell them I don’t drink. When going out with my colleagues, I would just order soft drink or juice and no one is bothered by that. This is very different from my home country, where you would be made fun of or insulted if you refuse to drink.
It’s a really good question. Basically, alcohol is an addictive drug. Everyone gets hooked on it, if they drink enough. You build up tolerance and need more and more to get a buzz. I was up to around half a bottle of whisky a night just to maintain the flow of endorphins.
That’s why drinkers end up hating themselves. You become a slave to the drink.
You’ve probably heard this one before: First the man drinks the drink; then the drink drinks the drink; finally the drink drinks the man.
It’s a lot of fun to drink, and it is wholeheartedly embraced by the culture here (like many other places of course). But if you realise that it has become a problem, I would recommend stopping.
I used a book called This Naked Mind https://www.amazon.com/This-Naked-Mind-Discover-Happiness-ebook/dp/B077VTJC8P
If you read it, she tells you just what to do and why. In my opinion it is much better than AA. You don’t even have to quit entirely. It’s about changing your relationship to alcohol. I don’t even miss drinking any more. You realise that all you are doing is numbing yourself, knocking yourself out. You can still totally enjoy spending time with people. I mean there probably is even a way to have just a drink or two now and then with friends. That’s kind of the ideal.
It’s really about being in control. Who is in control, you, or the drink?
I’ve been sober about three months. The only downside is being 100% “on” all the time. I am completely immersed in whatever I am doing, which is great, much better than when I was drinking, but it also means I have to face the scary stuff, which I could avoid with alcohol. But facing the scary stuff is part of being alive. Better deal with it when I am still alive, than after I die (if you believe in an afterlife that is).
just work from home and have no friends or other social contacts. it’s simple.
I have a two-drink maximum. It can be two glasses of beer or wine or ume-shu or two shots of tequila or vodka or whatever, it doesn’t matter. After that, iced oolong tea or ginger ale the rest of the way. Yeah I used to get teased by co-workers and friends but they never push me to drink more. It’s all good.
i only drink tea when joining nomikai. Tell them i have medical issue with stomach and it is
Just drink nonalcoholic drinks!! Nobody is forcing you to drink alcohol
Non alcohol beer and lots of exercise. Helps the mood and feels like a lot more constructive way to live.
Truth? AA. There’s a large English speaking AA community in Japan, and while I don’t frequent meetings as much as most, I still found they helped me a lot in kicking the habit. The online meetings are great because you don’t have to turn on your camera or even participate if you don’t want to.
That and exercise. And when I do go out with friends who drink or if I’m at work mixers or functions, I just tell people I don’t drink.
Some people are surprised because they know me from my drinking days, but anyone with any sense won’t pry further after you say “I drank too much and I wanted to stop.”
For better or worse, I usually avoid going to events where people will be drunk. Dealing with drunk people when you’re sober is a special kind of hell. But this does mean that I end up skipping social events because I know I won’t be having a good time.
I definitely relate to you about not knowing when to stop, when I used to drink (15+ years ago) I realised “one drink is too many, and 10 is never enough”. Even when I went out with the plan to limit myself to 2 drinks, I would just break it.
Just say u do not drink tonight and order ginger ale.
How had every post here been voted down? Anyway as a 34 year old who quit drinking at 24, thanks for the reassuring and rational comments everyone. See you next year in Japan at the juice bar. Maybe I’ll open one!
Get a zero beer, and if you *have* to have an excuse, say it’s for medication. Gosh, you really want to but your medicine won’t allow it. They won’t ask, you won’t tell, and you can coast drinking dry zeros to your hearts content.
But if you’re out with coworkers be a party boy. If they’re sharing gossip, you’re sharing gossip. If they’re drunk singing karaoke, put your best voice on and dial in. You don’t have to drink to have fun, and you don’t even have to drink to work culture let off steam. But when they’re drunk you’re “not recording” and more playful. And when it’s office hours you forget all of that
I don’t like the taste of alcohol, but I still go out and order sodas and the like. Japan has such an awesome soda, juice, and tea selection, I don’t feel like I’m missing out LOL
Honestly, nobody I hang out with and none of my friends drink. None of my coworkers have asked me to drink in years. It’s the kind of people you’re hanging out with.
The way I see it, me and my friends are all young-ish in shape, active guys. Wtf do I wanna sit around and gossip over drinks like an old lady? Id rather be riding motorcycles, or taking a road trip, or going to the gym, or going hiking, or playing with the dogs or anything except that. I honestly don’t see what you people are getting out of it.
I should add that my family is notorious for alcohol abuse. I’ve made some hints about some of the stuff but never talked about it on here. Normal people in my family become absolute monsters and criminals when they drink. It was enough to make me not want to drink.
Both my grandparents on my moms side are mixed Native American. I wonder if there’s some kind of genetic component there to insanely awful alcohol tolerance.
Alcoholic here. First off, it is perfectly okay to say that you are allergic to alcohol if you don’t want to drink. It is a legitimate excuse used here. Second, there are non-alcoholic beverages you can enjoy. Ginger Ale is very popular. Third, though I have no problem attending a drinking party now. I’m not gonna drink. But in the beginning of my sobriety, I reminded myself why I was attending a party, and that was to enjoy being with people and helping them to enjoy it as well. It was a purpose other than drinking which I could focus on. Anyways, best wishes.
Lots of people don’t drink at nomikai. Find a nice mocktail you like or just oolong. Flavored tansan is a good substitute for the mouth feel of drinking something alcoholic I think.
Just tell people you don’t drink and get a non-alcoholic beverage. Most of the time they just want you to be part of the fun and get to know you better. The assholes who try to force you to drink is the issue, and it such cases don’t hesitate to just get up and leave.
Why can’t you just say that you don’t drink and order some non-alcoholic drink instead? It sounds as if you’re letting others decide for you.
Before the pandemic, when I went out with friends or coworkers they all ended up ordering beer and including me in the count. I have never liked beer, so I just corrected them removing one beer from the count and ordering a glass of red wine instead. Then three years ago I bought a car, and because I’m usually driving when going out, I stopped drinking completely, ordering orange juices or 烏龍茶 instead. Nobody cares.
If you don’t want to drink, then don’t.
It’s all about who you hang out with, and how you like to spend your time. I just don’t bother with activities and hanging out with people where the expectation is drinking, and choose a different group instead.
I don’t drink, don’t use excuses and almost never had a problem. Only once, a few years ago, an older associate, judging from his drinking habits probably an alcoholic himself, made a snide remark – but that was it. I ignored him.
There are at least three colleagues I can think of who live like me as well. No problems as far as I can tell.
Now, I do not have the classic office job, so this might play a role. But there also is a number of younger Japanese colleagues who do not want to spend that much money on alcohol / at least not to get plastered with colleagues.
Just try being authentic and see if that works would be my advice.
My wife doesn’t drink due to health issues so I stopped as well in solidarity. Last drink was before I moved to Japan. Life in Japan seems fine, no one is pressuring me to drink socially and people understand when I say I don’t drink alcohol. It’s a non-issue and I can have a good time without drinking. I drank socially in Australia prior to leaving but even then, I wasn’t a heavy drinker.
Consider the reasons you drink, and the circumstances. If you feel you can’t have fun without alcohol, try find things to do that you find interesting that don’t involve alcohol. If you feel you can’t socialise without alcohol, try it a few times and see if you can’t have fun.
I was worried I couldn’t do karaoke without drinking. Tried it and it’s fine.
Edit: wanted to add that the desire is there. I see people drinking and having a good time; that’s the hardest pressure to ignore I’ve experienced so far.
I just say truth, I don’t like alcohol , so I don’t drink actually in Japan almost everyone understood and didn’t pushed me to drink
I’ve never had any problem telling people that I stopped drinking, and I never had a single person react badly. The reason why I stopped is that I have experienced working as a caretaker in a mental hospital that was half filled with alcoholics in a really really bad state. One day one of our doctors showed me a x-ray of one of our patient’s brain and it was terrifying how badly it had shrinked, explaining why he wasn’t able to hold a normal conversation or even walk straight anymore.
I calculated how much I had drank till then, remembered that at my age no new brain cells are created and decided that I couldn’t lose even more of it to alcohol on top of natural aging.
A part of the culture is intertwined with eating/drinking out in groups, but *alcoholic* drinks are definitely not necessary. No one will shame you for choosing non-alcoholic beer, or drinking tea. If they do, make some effort to get better friends. 🤷♂️
I kinda feel like you’re looking for ways to shift blame for your own lack of impulse control and your alcoholism – buying booze at combinis on your way home everyday? There’s no one but yourself accountable for that – if you truly hate it, stop. Keep on walking past. Or walk a block over in a small side street with no combinis, figure out a route from station to home that doesn’t pass one etc, if you really can’t help yourself otherwise. If you can’t control your impulses, that’s ok, it can be hard especially at first – take concrete steps to remove/reduce temptations instead. Google cognitive behavioral therapy + alcoholism, and have a read on it. Alcohol addiction is not easy to kick but acknowledging you have a problem, and *not* trying to shift blame elsewhere, is a positive first step to take. Take more steps, even small ones, to change your bad habits, or remove/reduce environmental temptations. And acknowledge the friends you choose are also a part of that environment. If they’re pressuring you, and won’t stop if you talk to them about it, cut them out of your life.
And yea, there’s for sure some not-insignificant pressure in many companies to attend frequent nomikais etc, but amongst friends definitely not so – in my experience places like the UK have 10000% more “don’t know how to socialise, in any context, without a pint in my hand” culture than here. Again, even at work nomikais you CAN, as others have also said, choose non-alcoholic drinks.
Maybe try meetup.com, do activities after work or on weekends that don’t involve being in a restaurant/bar/club? Don’t feel like being active sometimes? Invite a friend or two over to Netflix/game, make popcorn, crack a big soda, order some pizza, hang out doing fun/entertaining things *without booze involved *.
Best of luck to you on getting control over your alcohol/impulse issues, and on making body-positive choices by making nice friends to spend your free time with in other ways. 🍀
Alcoholic here, dry a few decades.
As for getting along without drinking, what u/abcxyz89 writes jibes with my experience in Japan: I have to tell people ‘I don’t drink’ once, and that’s it. I’ve never had to explain it, and no one has ever questioned it or put any pressure on me in drinking settings. (I have had people ask me why I don’t drink when alcohol comes up in a situation when people are *not* drinking, but never at a party or restaurant.)
As for learning to not join the crowd, I’ve always found it helps to do something besides, away from, physically unrelated to, and psychically unrelated to work. For me, it was swimming, which forced me to remove my clothes and made drinking physically impossible; a local public swimming pool is open from early to late, so I could go at any time and could go alone.
It’s likely impossible for you, but if you feel the need to medicate yourself as a way of recovering from work, maybe you should try moving to another kind of work.
>Thing is, i hate it.
What exactly do you hate?
How it gets you drunk? The taste?
How you give into temptation which makes you feel mentally weak?
Having an answer to this would help 🙏
Admittedly I have a very good relationship with Alcohol.
In my 20’s I only ever used to drink on Fridays and Saturdays and now in my 30’s I only ever drink on Saturdays.
I don’t really do ‘hobbies’ outside of work but what I’ve adopted a strong habit of going to the gym early (Wake up at 5) and having a clear goal of what I want to achieve in terms of fitness, but also economically (which I work hard to achieve).
Perhaps you need to adapt a more Stoic mindset?
Meditate, be content with being alone.
>seems near impossible not to join in with the crowd.
This. Totally understand you.
It’s difficult at first it really ia. But it does get better once you have something bigger to strive for than getting intoxicated for one night.
Hope I was of some help.
Good luck.
For the first five years or so I lived in Japan I didn’t drink at all. Lots of events as a student, out at nightlife frequently, and tons of shows and uchiage as a member of a band. Nobody ever hassled me and I always was fine with oolong tea. Kind of sucked to pay for other people drinking when the bill was split though…
Then I started drinking mid-20s and quite happily took to it. Japan is a great place to drink… and drink too much. But I really did enjoy the social parts of it, even though I was just as social prior to drinking as well.
Flash forward to early 40s and weighing about 40 pounds more than I had to begin with. I started to feel like I was drinking too much – developed a really wonderful tolerance/dependence. Anyway, I quit cold turkey at the end of 2019. Still not a drop 3.5 years later. Loads of noticeable physical benefits, even aside from dropping most all of the weight I’d gained since my 20s.
The only person who hassled me a bit about not drinking was my girlfriend. Other than that social impact is nil – at bars, out with work colleagues, it’s never been a problem. Corona timing helped solidify the habit, I think. But now I go out and socialize like the before times, just without drinking. The rise of nonalcoholic beers has made things even easier due to the wider variety and availability of NA things to drink. Saving a ton on money too.